Recurring Water in Fuel Alarm/Thruster Issues

Ask away with your Ranger technical or pre-sales questions. A Ranger rep will give you the official scoop.

Re: Recurring Water in Fuel Alarm/Thruster Issues

Postby aculverwell on Thu Aug 17, 2017 2:59 pm

Thanks for all of the excellent information in this post. Please forgive this rookie question (as I haven't ever had water in my fuel system), but how do you typically dispose of any diesel fuel that you drain out of the separator?
aculverwell
 
Posts: 96
Joined: Fri Feb 13, 2015 2:52 pm
City: Carnation
State/Province: WA
Ranger/Cutwater Model: R-31 CB
Vessel Name: Red Sky

Re: Recurring Water in Fuel Alarm/Thruster Issues

Postby dclagett on Thu Aug 17, 2017 4:42 pm

Some marinas will let you dump it in the oil recycling tank. At home I look for hazardous wast recycling centers.
dclagett
 
Posts: 275
Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2016 9:30 am
City: Ocean Pines
State/Province: MD
Ranger/Cutwater Model: R-25 SC
Vessel Name: DreamChaser

Re: Recurring Water in Fuel Alarm/Thruster Issues

Postby knotflying on Thu Aug 17, 2017 5:01 pm

Admiral S wrote:I have run about 100 gallons of valvtect over about 80 hours on our 2017 R-27 and have not had any issues.

Lets us know how you have done after 1,400 hours and 5,000 gallons of fuel :P Valvetect is not a consistent culprit, but I can only say that it has happened to me on two occasions after fueling up with Valvetect. However, I have filled with Valvetect fuel on many occasions without issues.
“What we call reality is merely an ILLUSION we create for learning and enjoyment….”
knotflying
 
Posts: 4387
Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2010 5:42 pm
City: Charlestown
State/Province: RI
Ranger/Cutwater Model: R-27
Non-Ranger Model: http://illusionsmikeandjess.blogspot.com/
Vessel Name: (2011) Illusions

Re: Recurring Water in Fuel Alarm/Thruster Issues

Postby captstu on Thu Aug 17, 2017 5:43 pm

If you take the fuel that comes out of the separator and put it in a clear bottle and set it aside, the fuel will separate from the water. You could then carefully pour the fuel back into the separator, priming the separator to get the air out of the system.

There's nothing wrong with the fuel after it separates. Diesel fuel is stored at the refinery in tanks that have water in the bottom and Clay under the water. The water and fuel typically do not mix.

The problem happens when the docks selling the fuel gets a bad batch with too much water or wait too long to Drain their separators.


Stuart Bell
Ranger 25: Shearwater
(561) 352-1796
Stuart Bell (561) 352-1796
stu@Shearwater-sailing.com
R-25 Shearwater IV
captstu
 
Posts: 849
Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2014 7:07 pm
City: Delray Beach
State/Province: FL
Ranger/Cutwater Model: R-25 Classic
Vessel Name: Shearwater IV

Re: Recurring Water in Fuel Alarm/Thruster Issues

Postby gwishon on Sun Feb 24, 2019 8:21 am

I ran across this thread while researching the issue that occurred during our trip to the recent SWF Rendezvous. (As some of you know), about 2 hours after leaving our home port (Apollo Beach) for Burnt Store Marina, the D4-260 on our 2015 R29 began to surge, unable to run cleanly above 2300rpm, and throwing a check engine light and code, which our engine guy (who we were able to contact by phone) identified as either (1) a faulty fuel filter, or (2) clogged fuel tank pickup, or (3) faulty sensor. We were able to limp to Burnt Store (made for a long trip) and, thanks to Marty Colburn (on Snapshot) and Dan McClanahan (of Edgewater Yacht Sales), acquired and changed both fuel filters. Upon inspection, the 10micron Racor filter was found to be completely clogged with a dark colored, slimy material. We concluded that we had received a bad batch of fuel (the engine had just been serviced by Bluewater Marine a week before departure). The return trip was uneventful, although we cruised with limited rpms for most of the trip.

Upon return to home port, I pulled the (relatively new, about 10-15 hours running time) 10 micron filter and inspected it. While there was not much obvious buildup, I pulled apart the pleats and ran a screwdriver blade across the filter material. There was clear evidence of the same sort of slimy material beginning to build up again.

I am now making plans to have the fuel tank drained and cleaned, as well as considering installing swapping the filter housing with a dual housing to gain an additional level of filtering. I am also treating the tank with Biobor-JF and Startron Enzyme fuel treatment (thanks again, Marty!) The local company that will clean the tank suggests that the material I'm seeing on the filter results from water in the fuel/tank.

For those of you who have experienced this problem, is this a reasonable strategy to follow? The tank cleaning isn't cheap, but I'd like the comfort of knowing it's a clean tank that I'm working with, and hopefully the additional filtering and fuel treatment will help prevent the problem from recurring.

Also, if anyone has had this done before (tank cleaning), can the cleaning be done by accessing the tank from the removable panel in the floor just inside the salon door?

Gordon
gwishon
 
Posts: 33
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 8:21 am
City: Apollo Beach
State/Province: FL
Ranger/Cutwater Model: R-29 S
Vessel Name: Summertime

Re: Recurring Water in Fuel Alarm/Thruster Issues

Postby BB marine on Sun Feb 24, 2019 8:50 am

There are two ways of gaining access to the bottom of the tank. 1) through the fuel sender opening ( requires removing sender and installing a new gasket upon completion. 2) removing a fuel pick-up and installing a longer tube to reach the bottom of the tank. I have used #2 with good success and installed a tee fitting to one of the unused pickups on my tank.While doing this project I also removed the screen from the pick-up tubes. They are not needed for diesel fuel and over a period of time can get clogged. I have installed a fuel polishing system in the boat along with a Aux. fuel tank to prevent what happened to your boat. Photos are in my Album. Describing the system and draining the tank.
Brian Brown
Cutwater 26
PORT-A-GEE
portageelooper.blogspot.com
bkb_marine@msn.com
BB marine
 
Posts: 909
Joined: Mon Feb 01, 2016 10:30 pm
City: Lemont
State/Province: IL
Non-Ranger Model: 26 Cutwater
Vessel Name: PORT-A-GEE

Re: Recurring Water in Fuel Alarm/Thruster Issues

Postby gwishon on Sun Feb 24, 2019 9:01 am

Thanks, Brian. I've read the description of your project. I'm not sure our tank configurations are the same. I'm pretty certain I couldn't fit an aux tank into the engine bay of the R29. The generator consumes most of the available space.

But it certainly gives me some idea of how to proceed.

Gordon
gwishon
 
Posts: 33
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 8:21 am
City: Apollo Beach
State/Province: FL
Ranger/Cutwater Model: R-29 S
Vessel Name: Summertime

Re: Recurring Water in Fuel Alarm/Thruster Issues

Postby Brian B on Sun Feb 24, 2019 9:07 am

I treat every gallon of diesel that goes into my boat with FPPF. https://fppf.com/product/marine-forumla ... treatment/

With over 1000 hours on the Yanmar I have never had a fuel related problem (knock on wood). From what I understand this is the only product Yanmar recommends. You should check with Volvo as to what product they recommend you use.
Brian B
 
Posts: 853
Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2012 11:53 am
City: West Warwick
State/Province: RI
Ranger/Cutwater Model: R-25 SC
Vessel Name: GANSETT RANGER (2010) Yanmar 4BY2-150

Re: Recurring Water in Fuel Alarm/Thruster Issues

Postby captstu on Sun Feb 24, 2019 9:31 am

I believe there are several treatments such as Biobor that will slow down the formation of the slime that grows on the interface between the water in the bottom of your diesel tank (if any) and the fuel itself.

Once water is present, I don't believe these treatments will dissolve or emulsify the water such as the alcohol-based treatments might do in gasoline.

This is both good and bad. Once you observe a small amount of water in the bottom of your fuel filter - either directly or by sampling the filter and letting it settle in a small, tall, glass container, you can remove the water mechanically as Brian suggests.

I use a small flexible plastic tube such as a refrigerator ice maker supply tube, and tape it to a plastic rod like the kinds the exterminators use to mark a sprayed lawn. Then I remove the tube that draws fuel from the top of the tank, clean and remove the screen and insert the small clean out pipe. I attach the pipe to a sall electric "universal" fuel pump and to a racor filter - leading the output back into the tank.

I pump in a circle until no water shows up in the filter for 30 minutes of pumping. This takes several cycles as I stop and drain whatever water is found frequently until none is observed.

You can pull a cup or so of water out on each cycle. I use a soda bottle to draw off the water by holding it under the valve on the bottom of the Racor, decanting the fuel back into the tank if any gets into the bottle.

There is nothing wrong with the fuel and most of the tank is not really dirty, just water and slime that you can filter out.

Once you are done, assemble and inspect the fuel separator on the bottom of the Racor every few hours until no water is observed - then change the Racor element once more and you should have no more problems.

Dirty and time consuming, but fairly easy and reliable.
Stuart Bell (561) 352-1796
stu@Shearwater-sailing.com
R-25 Shearwater IV
captstu
 
Posts: 849
Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2014 7:07 pm
City: Delray Beach
State/Province: FL
Ranger/Cutwater Model: R-25 Classic
Vessel Name: Shearwater IV

Re: Recurring Water in Fuel Alarm/Thruster Issues

Postby gwishon on Sun Feb 24, 2019 9:38 am

Thanks, Brian! Thanks, Stu!

Gordon
gwishon
 
Posts: 33
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 8:21 am
City: Apollo Beach
State/Province: FL
Ranger/Cutwater Model: R-29 S
Vessel Name: Summertime

Re: Recurring Water in Fuel Alarm/Thruster Issues

Postby quinsky on Sun Feb 24, 2019 11:16 pm

I've also had a problem with the "Water in fuel" alarm on my c28 with Volvo Penta D4 260. It would appear when I first cranked the engine. I would shut it down, turn the battery switch off and on and then restart the engine. This took care of the problem for awhile until the alarm kept coming on after every restart. I installed a new sensor but this did not solve the problem. Recently my starting battery has been unable to crank the engine when its cold and I have to turn on the crossover switch to start it. (My boat is a 2013 with the original batteries so yes I'm going to replace them). I noticed when I do this the alarm does not come on. I'm thinking low voltage is tripping the alarm. I spoke with Kevin Lamont of Ranger Tugs at the SW FL Rendezvous and he agreed.
Patrick Quinn
quinsky
 
Posts: 159
Joined: Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:08 pm
City: Murrells Inlet
State/Province: SC
Ranger/Cutwater Model: C-28
Vessel Name: Compass Rose
MMSI Number: 338302374

Re: Recurring Water in Fuel Alarm/Thruster Issues

Postby gwishon on Mon Feb 25, 2019 6:43 am

I've never received a "Water in Fuel" alarm. When the problem first appeared, I got a Check Engine warning accompanied by the code MID: 128 PSID: 50 FMI: 0 OC C: --- STATUS: INACTIVE

I took a picture of the display and texted it to the mechanic that services my engine. His diagnosis was a bad filter or clogged tank pickup. Upon inspection, the filter was clearly clogged.
gwishon
 
Posts: 33
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2018 8:21 am
City: Apollo Beach
State/Province: FL
Ranger/Cutwater Model: R-29 S
Vessel Name: Summertime

Re: Recurring Water in Fuel Alarm/Thruster Issues

Postby Foundator on Wed Mar 27, 2019 12:08 pm

If there is no water in fuel then the problem may be in sensor. Nevertheless keep your tank full of fuel to reduce condensation.
Foundator
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2019 11:37 am
City: Chicago
State/Province: IL
Ranger/Cutwater Model: C-30 CB

Previous

Return to Ask the Ranger Factory

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest