10. More. Knots.

[jkurlanski]

I just wanted to throw this out there. We love our 2009 R21-EC. Its the perfect size for day cruising and it's a ton of fun. The admiral can manage it just fine and feels comfortable at the helm. Plus there's plenty of time to answer the inevitable "which side of the red thingy am I supposed to be on?"

The only wish we have is for a little more speed. We're not asking for crazy speed. I don't need to get up to 30 knots. I don't even need 20. I would just like another 10 knots.

This is not born out of a need for speed. Been there. Spent that gas money. Its just that occasionally things come up when you're on the water: unexpected weather, change in wave heights, a need to maneuver, or someone gets ill. It would be nice to kick it into a little higher gear to get to safety. Most of the time, the R21 is just perfect as it is.

I checked out the R23 pretty extensively this spring, but came away disappointed. Much more than I really was looking for and not much reason not to jump to a R25, IMO, but I'm sure some will find it perfect.

So I thought I'd put it out there for discussion. Is it just me or do others agree? I know the factory is focused on bigger and badder, but there's a few of us who appreciate the slow life, but maybe not quite that slow. Or maybe changes are on the horizon?

Thanks!

 

[Two killicks]

After reading about this subject on this forum in the past, I understood that it seems nearly impossible to do so with the hull shape that we have. I totally agree with your point.

I use the tug in a 4-5 knots strong current area of the St Lawrence River, let me tell you that you must run with the tide (which rise 15-19 feets) up here in Quebec City... Sometime we get caught when the tide change direction and the Wind unexpectedly change direction or increase speed especially against the tide. We are in for a rough ride, and it is sometime hard to predict... The ride becomes rough and it's almost a stand still situation... Another 5 kts would be nice for sure.

 

[Champ]

When my wife and I discovered the Ranger R-21 we new that was the boat for us. Thankfully we had a day out on one and realized this boat is "SLOW". No way would it work for us. We went with the R-23 outboard and could not be happier with it. We are mainly day boaters with hopefully the occasional over night. When we stay over night we will dine out and use the marinas facilities. No major cooking, showering etc. We have a spot on the Hudson river about 50 miles from our marina that we like to go to, anchor and relax. Have lunch and fish a bit. Takes us about two hours at a nice cruising speed. With the R-21 it would be impossible as it may take 12 hours! R-21 is a nice boat but not very practical for most. Try before you buy.

 

[JamesTXSD]

My take: the R-21EC is a great boat for what it is: a small displacement day boat, that would be decent for an occasional overnight with a friendly companion. The speed is what the boat is designed for. Sailors understand this. If you are wishing for another 10 knots, you bought the wrong boat.

While some have cruised them great distances (I recall reading about 3 R-21s that made the trek to Alaska from Washington State), I see the R-21 as a day boat with great character and looks that would be most at home on a lake... smiling and waving as you pass your neighbors on their docks. Toasting to the sunset at anchor or when tied back to your dock.

It isn't a "slow boat," it is a boat that goes as fast as it was designed to go. Buying this boat and hoping to go fast would make about as much sense as buying one of those "gold necklace" boats with 4 300 hp motors on the back, and cruising it all the time at 5 knots.

The R-21 is one of those boats that makes me smile every time I see one.

 

[jkurlanski]

Just to be clear - we love our Tug. I was able to test drive it before buying, I fully understand what I got, why its that way, and we plan accordingly. We've done numerous day cruises and a few overnights on the bay. The simplicity and slow speed have been an asset to increasing everyone's comfort level on the water.

I don't wish for the Ruby Belle to go another 10 knots. Maybe a better question is if there is interest in a similar style of tug with a little more horsepower down the line.

Thanks all.

 

[Pilotnavigator]

A properly equipped 21ec can make a great cruise boat for two. Need a well designed cockpit enclosure with an integrated support for a solar panel. Extra batteries and a good anchoring system. With a BBQ on the swim rail and converting the engine box top into a kitchen area most needs are covered. We have stayed out for 6 to 8 weeks ,most at anchor, the past few summers. We only return to port to fill up the water, pump out and get supplies. See out pictures in the album for ideas.

 

[baz]

A properly equipped 21ec can make a great cruise boat for two. Need a well designed cockpit enclosure with an integrated support for a solar panel. Extra batteries and a good anchoring system. With a BBQ on the swim rail and converting the engine box top into a kitchen area most needs are covered. We have stayed out for 6 to 8 weeks ,most at anchor, the past few summers. We only return to port to fill up the water, pump out and get supplies. See out pictures in the album for ideas.

Your cockpit canopy/cover is absolutely awesome. I REALLY like the design. We have the 2016 Ranger Gray R21-EC just like yours as well. We had the King Marine design and install our canopy/covering and King Marine could well take a few design point/tips from what you have.

Do you cruise lake waters or the open seas ?

 

[Pilotnavigator]

We cruise the north channel of Lake Huron. We have done so for the past 12 years. The first 9 in a Compac Sun Cat. So we know small boat outfitting. We still canoe trip in the spring and fall. Klacko Manrine and Precision Canvas did the work. Doug at Klacko made the mooring bit and the custom anchor roller to fit the Rocna anchor. Much stronger than the factory roller. The key was to arrange the system around a 2 inch main roll bar that holds the bar for the solar panel. Another point is having the frame extend beyond the sides and back. This keeps the canvas inches away from the rear seats and gives more room to walk around the cockpit. The posts are strong and provide secure hand hold when the boat rocks. Not the cheapest cockpit enclosure but the best I have seen.

 

[jkurlanski]

Interesting that Baz, if I'm reading this right, downgraded from the R25 to the R21. Faster to slower, if you will:

SOLD - 2010 R-25 LAXEY
2016 Ranger Gray R-21EC LAXEY

How has your experience been between the two boats? Do you ever find you miss he extra HP or are you fine as is?

 

[baz]

Fine as is.

We had fun and great use out of the R-25 for 5+ years. As time unfolds so do requirements and life conditions change and it made no sense getting a bigger boat so we went for the smaller R-21EC as we wanted to stick with the Ranger Tug model line we had grown used to. The RTs are built in our area and having the sales and factories close by makes sense for us.

Personally, I find the R-21EC much more fun to operate/use vs. the R25. The larger the boat the more you rely on its mechanics and electronics for operating it, plus the bigger the boat the more effort is required from the Captain to get the boat to do want you want. For the R-21EC being smaller it's so much more responsive to the helm and other inputs. It's kind of being much more in control of the boat vs. the bigger boat having it's way and slower response to inputs.

The R-21EC is light and nimble and very sea worthy IMO. It's fun to maneuver about and I actually like the rocking and rolling knowing the boat is safe and not in any real danger of getting into trouble.

The one disappointment is the alcohol stove which IMO is rather pathetic.

We have the RayMarine auto pilot which works well and provides effortless cruising when cruising long distance stretches.

We have our R-21EC outfitted with just about all the options RT provides except for A/C which we don't need here in the PNW.

The R-21EC is a very nice, cost effective, easy to maintain and a really fun boat to operate.

 

[jkurlanski]

GREAT response. Its exactly the feedback I was looking for. Thank you so much. The grass is not always greener on the other side. 🙂

We certainly don't need the AC up here in Maine either. But the heater gets plenty of use! And thankfully, we still have the older butane stove which works great for a pot of coffee.

 

[BillE]

Joe, could you tell this newbie what you are cruising at and what your top usable speed is?

I like these little boats and think this former sailor would be fine with the slow speed, just not so sure about the seating in the cabin. I wonder if anyone has taken out the burner and sink and put in a decent companion's seat? Or is there even room for that?

 

[Pilotnavigator]

I agree about the alcohol stove, never usd it so I took it out and covered the hole with a wood plug. Gives more access to the space under the sink. Will reinstall it if we sell it. This way there is no chance of breaking the glass cover. We always cook on the engine cover with a one burner butane stove. One can of butane lasts about three days. We found a nice nautical looking plastic coated table cloth to protect the engine cushion. All prep, and washing up is done here.
Cutting boards and Rubbermaid wash tubs work great.

We cruise at 5.5 to 6.2 knots, we pull a 8 foot porta-bote with a 2.5 on it so this slows us a bit. Typically at 2000 to 2500 RPM.

 

[jkurlanski]

Cruising speed of the R21-EC is about 6.5 knots. That's a good comfortable, low vibration, low rpm that will allow you to go all day, all week, all month on a tank of diesel (its quite awesome).

I've gotten her up over 10 knots once. We were coming out of a tidal river on a full moon ebb tide, with a strong wind behind us. We were haulin'. :lol: Of course, coming back in, in was substantially less....

My tug has a seat which fits in over the sink/stove top and remains there most of the time. I believe that's standard. Its a great co-pilot seat and has a step that comes out or folds away very easily.

 

[baz]

Yes, the companion/Nav seat works well IMO. I adjusted the front feet to fit tightly up to the front fiddle bar so that the seat does not move about as it would in stock condition. This makes the seat feel a lot more stable/secure.

My grandkids fight over who's going to sit on the Nav seat all the time. :lol:

From a previous R-21EC owner we name the vertical chrome pole the "Stripper pole". 😱 ...just flick the night-time red lights on and off at the same time while hanging onto the pole. :lol:

 

[BillE]

6.5 is doable, thanks. I would also be interested in a larger version, but I do not believe that there is enough market for such a boat to be built and sold today.

 

[Cutwater28GG]

there are only two choices.

1. displacement hull speed with low fuel consumption which is directly proportional to water line length. but you'd be up at 130 feet long at the water line before you could expect 15 knots!
2. planing hull. R23, cutwater 26/28/30. more power more speed on the right hull design. the fuel economy of the onboard diesel cutwaters is rather good. with the semi displacement hull of my c28 i get best of both worlds.

 

[jkurlanski]

Yeah, I do understand that the current displacement hull design on the 21 is speed limiting. You can throw more engine at it and it will go faster, but its a waste of fuel and it won't be comfortable. Hull speed is not the end all be all, but its not much fun over that.

It appears they did something rather interesting with the R23 hull. Is it a semi-displacement? Full? Something else entirely? Can something similar to 23' be applied to the 21 or does the 6' 8" beam make that a non-starter? (Now we're WAY outta my depth...)

I'm reaching...I know. Really I just need to get out on the water soon before I drive my wife and the rest of you crazy....or buy a 25' :lol:

 

[Red Raven]

There is a continuous range of hull shapes possible from full displacement to full planing. Most boats don't easily fit into one description exactly. It is my understanding that the R21EC is close to a full displacement hull. This allows it to use a much smaller engine and save cost with a very comfortable quiet ride. I believe the R23 is probably best described as somewhere between semi displacement and a deep V full planing hull, probably closer to the latter (and the C24 even more so). This allows for much greater speeds but also requires a lot more horsepower and thus cost. There is no question that Ranger could build a 21 foot version of this hull but it would not have the economics of the R21EC. The beam is not a problem. Maybe some day, but I kind of doubt it. I think if you want to go fast just get the R23 or C24.

Curt

 

[Boris the Tug]

From a previous R-21EC owner we name the vertical chrome pole the "Stripper pole"

Hahaha the stripper pole is one of the first things we noticed on this boat!