Just pulled the trigger on a new Ranger Gray 2016 R-21EC

baz

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Subject: Just pulled the trigger on a new 2016 R-21EC

Well after, several weeks after having sold our MY2010 R-25 (Classic) and having been discussing the R-21EC with Andrew & Jeff, we pulled the trigger today and ordered up a Ranger Gray 2016 R-21EC with a new Gray matching King Marine flat Bimini top and Full Enclosure that has no vertical poles for its entire length of the cockpit... great for swinging around a fishing rod off the side or hauling in crab pots etc. :lol:

Some may consider this a 'down size' which it is physically compared to our previous R-25. However, we consider it an upgrade that more closely matches our new boating requirements.

The long one and two week trips were/was becoming too much for us, the cost for keeping the boat in a covered moorage in salt water, the professional & DIY maintenance, running costs, 4 monthly anode replacements frequency and every 3 years doing bottom paint renewing were all taking their toll and resulting in less and less time on the water for us. The R-25 is a fine boat for sure but we simply outlived its usefulness for us.

Over past weekend Paul & Sunny (TugBug) at Port Of Edmonds were kind enough to put up with me asking all my questions and took me out for a sea trail on their R-21EC. They let me have the helm and I have to say, I thoroughly enjoyed the thrill of being more in touch with the water compared to the R-25. The R-25 certainly moves about less in rolling sea than does the R-21EC and protects you more from and 'removes' you from the elements, but the R-21EC amazed me to be more fun to drive/operate/ride and handles well while still giving me comfort in safety. As a boy growing up in southern England just west of Dover I was constantly going out to sea in all kinds of weather in an open one mast fishing tourist boat that held around 30 people. It had an engine box much like the R-21EC has and I can still hear the glorious engine chugging sounds it made. The rocking and rolling motion in this boat was a delight to this person. Salt water spray on the face was heaven. I made these trips as a boy as much as I could afford. The R-21EC brings this same experience back for me.

The long open cockpit space is heavenly compared to the R-25's and the well designed transom seating with a nice foot step is very enjoyable and comfortable sitting in this location.

Paul & Sunny had warned me about engine noise but to me it was not an issue at all. Sunny and I sitting on the transom seating could talk and hear each other with engine idling and all the way to WOT. One does have to shout out from the transom area to the pilot house for the helmsman to hear as the WOT is approached. I actually liked the engine noise. 😎

I noticed the R-21EC will actually become more directional stable as the speed picks up... but this could have been the sea conditions. Comparing this with the R-25 I have to say as speed increased on the R-25 its directional stability became less and I had to constantly tweak the wheel. For the R-21EC the wheel kept steady and required no trimming at speed. Maybe it's the large rudder that the R-21EC has... but dunno. The R-25 has quite a small rudder and is not very effective at below 4 kts.

Pushing the R-21EC hard over at speed she turned around in about its own length without any uncomfortable motion or leaning.

There's a bit more vibration on the R-21EC compared to the R-25, but it's not annoying or really of any concern for this person.

Squeezing into the pilot house between the deployed helms seat and the sink/stove counter and 'stripper pole' :roll: is a bit tight and one needs to slide through this area sideways, and maybe for a large person will require a deep inhale. :lol: However, once inside it's cosy and 'tight fitting'. Visibility is outstanding and the paragraphic wipers are a huge improvement over the R-25 wipers IMO.

I love the two port holes in the V-berth.... something the R-25 did not have. I like looking out sideways and this was not possible in the R-25's V-berth.

I will be adding some fiddles to the various shelving in the pilot house, just as I had to in the R-25. I will likely also add fiddles for the standard cockpit table that attaches to the rear of the engine box.

Engine box... what can I say, Access is simply wonderful as well as the access to the two batteries. I imagine the DIY maintenance will be a dream compared to the R-25.

I will be trailering this R-21EC and keeping her in my house driveway.

Andrew and Jeff made my decision for the R-21EC a very pleasant experience and were both patient with me asking all sorts of questions. Not once did I feel they were becoming impatient with me. Andrew was at his best 7 days a week always giving me his best advice with that commanding voice of his. 🙂

So, Laxey will live on as well as in DreamSpeaker's "Puget Sound, A Boater's Guide" (page 50). :lol:

Expected delivery is between mid to end of August... can't wait for it to arrive. 🙂
 
Hello Barry,

CONGRATULATIONS! You will LOVE the 21EC - it is great boat.

What will you name her?

dave
 
Barry,

Thank you for putting your trust in us for boat number two. I'm excited to hear about all of the new adventures in your 21EC! I have to say, I'm quite excited to see the new matching canvas from Dave!
 
Hey Andrew.... My grown family of 3 in Seattle and San Francisco are all simply in love with this R-21EC. In fact, my youngest daughter in SF was with me a year or so back at your Ranger Tug show in Anacortes Cape Sante. She liked the R-31 and modeled herself for a selfie on the fly bridge, but her heart was assigned to the R-21EC.... she said... "It sleeps two... cool and it has a nice little potty in the middle." :lol:

Don't be surprised if you get 3 more R-21EC orders down the road. 😉
 
Congratulations Barry! You are going to love your new "Laxey".

David and Maureen
 
Best Wishes and congratulations Barry! Sounds like a perfect fit. I know that the canvas from Dave at King will be top notch.

More fun less work....what a deal.
 
Congratulations Barry, We took delivery of our new 21ec in May, and just love the boat
I am going to try reducing the engine noise by adding 1" of sound insulation to the existing insulation, perhaps that will help.
I am also adding a Simrad AP24 autopilot with the "S drive" for cable steered boats next week. The Raymarine Sport Pilot is no longer available, and the Simrad unit looks like it will do the job. At the low speed of the 21ec, an auto pilot will make longer voyages more enjoyable. I am planing to use a 20 degree bezel on the steering column, so that the Simrad unit clears the windsheild wiper moters, and give a little more clearance for my knees. I will keep you posted how it works out
Cheers, Andrew
 
If I had chosen to buy a used R-21EC I would have looked for one with AP. As you posted, RayMarine no longer sells the AP unit for the R-21EC so Ranger cannot offer this option any longer.

I'm curious about the cost for the Simrad AP24 AP even though I'm not really interested in having an AP at this time. I agree, for long voyages the AP would be a welcomed addition as I always used AP on my R-25 extensively for longer trips. I don't anticipate long trip in my R-21EC. BTW... What is the "S drive" ?
 
Congrats. Wonderful colour and yes they sure are fun to be out and about in. 😀
 
Congrats on your new purchase. It is great that a member offered to answer all your questions and take you for a ride. I am hoping at some point to be able to ask the same thing. Get my wife on a boat and show her you can stay overnight or even a few days. She feels a 21 EC would be to small even though she has never been on one. Would love to see some new pic's of your boat when you get it. 😀

Regards
Pete
 
Hey Barry,

I know you said you would wait on the AP...however, I wanted to make you aware of a sale at Anchor Express on the Simrad AP for mechanically steered boats. You could get it now at a great price and have the factory install it. You will LOVE having a AP. Even for short trips it's handy. But, alas, it is not mandatory.

Just wanted to put it out there this AP was on sale.

http://www.anchorexpress.com/Simrad-AP2 ... -10908-001

dave

Disclosure: I have no financial or other interest in Anchor Express or Simrad.
 
Dave: Thanks for that info. I'm looking into it and getting advice from Andrew before proceeding.

Question: When installing this AP will the steering wheel be moved out and closer to the helm seat, and if so, how many inches would this be ? I ask, as sitting on the R-21EC's helm seat I found there but a few inches between my knees and the wheel which was OK, but if the wheel was much closer it might be an annoyance and a tight fit for me.
 
andrew":rlcrauci said:
Congratulations Barry, We took delivery of our new 21ec in May, and just love the boat
I am going to try reducing the engine noise by adding 1" of sound insulation to the existing insulation, perhaps that will help.
I am also adding a Simrad AP24 autopilot with the "S drive" for cable steered boats next week. The Raymarine Sport Pilot is no longer available, and the Simrad unit looks like it will do the job. At the low speed of the 21ec, an auto pilot will make longer voyages more enjoyable. I am planing to use a 20 degree bezel on the steering column, so that the Simrad unit clears the windsheild wiper moters, and give a little more clearance for my knees. I will keep you posted how it works out
Cheers, Andrew

Andrew Appleton: Is the Simrad AP24 considered to be a DIY installation ? Dave (SGIDAVE) has alerted me today about a good price for the Simrad AP24 which has peeked my interest in having AP for my R-21EC.

Can you explain further what you mean by "I am planing to use a 20 degree bezel on the steering column, so that the Simrad unit clears the windsheild wiper moters, and give a little more clearance for my knees.". The knee clearance issue concerns me also. Thanks 🙂

I wonder if the helm seat securing bolts can be moved back a bit to provide more space. I know there's a seat slider that can be added but don't want to go the route if I don't have to.
 
baz":uummh2c6 said:
andrew":uummh2c6 said:
Congratulations Barry, We took delivery of our new 21ec in May, and just love the boat
I am going to try reducing the engine noise by adding 1" of sound insulation to the existing insulation, perhaps that will help.
I am also adding a Simrad AP24 autopilot with the "S drive" for cable steered boats next week. The Raymarine Sport Pilot is no longer available, and the Simrad unit looks like it will do the job. At the low speed of the 21ec, an auto pilot will make longer voyages more enjoyable. I am planing to use a 20 degree bezel on the steering column, so that the Simrad unit clears the windsheild wiper moters, and give a little more clearance for my knees. I will keep you posted how it works out
Cheers, Andrew

Andrew Appleton: Is the Simrad AP24 considered to be a DIY installation ? Dave (SGIDAVE) has alerted me today about a good price for the Simrad AP24 which has peeked my interest in having AP for my R-21EC.

Can you explain further what you mean by "I am planing to use a 20 degree bezel on the steering column, so that the Simrad unit clears the windsheild wiper moters, and give a little more clearance for my knees.". The knee clearance issue concerns me also. Thanks 🙂

I wonder if the helm seat securing bolts can be moved back a bit to provide more space. I know there's a seat slider that can be added but don't want to go the route if I don't have to.

Hello Barry,

The Simrad S drive fits BEHIND the helm so should not change the fore/aft wheel position.

I believe the unit is DIY installable. This is a 'relative' term, however, given our differing mechanical and electrical apptitudes and access to shop space/tooling/etc.

Note, my AP is the Raymarine which I DID install myself without much difficulty. The Raymarine uses a rudder position sensor - I don't know if the Simrad requires one. If it is 'optional,' I would still install it. My understanding is that it provides better info to the course computer compared to the 'virtual' rudder sensors.

Back to the rudder sensor...you will need BETTER access to the rudder than is possible with the standard round access plate. I installed a larger hatch over the rudder gear when i installed my kit. I believe it was approx 10" x 20" size. I suggest telling the factory to put in the larger hatch for you during the build. On the other hand, if you have an appropriate hole saw (who's radius matches the new hatch's radii), simply drill 4 holes for the 'corners,' then get your sabre saw and cut 4 straight lines to connect the corner holes. The hole saw makes quick work of the rounded corners since there is NOT room to comfortably swing the sabre saw.

You will need to become proficient in setting up an N2K network. This is not difficult as long as you follow the simple rules you will read about when you search online for such things. The most challenging part is sourcing the various cables to connect everything together. But the N2K networking is MUCH easier than the old NMEA0183 with its TINY wires...YIKES! I have Garmin, Simrad, and Raymarine on my N2K network, so the cabling is doable. And it's GREAT when everything on the network communicates.

If you decide to do the installation yourself, you will really KNOW how it's put together and how your N2K is set up so that any future problems will be more easily rectified since YOU set it up! That's a good thing...

Just my $0.02

/dave
 
Dave(SGIDAVE)

I spoke with Andrew Custis today and one of my questions about installing the Simrad AP was whether any work needed to be done in the rudder section/control area. He said NO. All the work is done at the helm. Maybe the Raymarine rudder sensor was the reason you needed access to the rudder area.

That's good info on the S-Drive being behind the helm thus does not not reduce the wheel to helm seat distance.... Thanks for posting that snippet. 🙂

Some other Tugnut said is takes 1 hour to install :roll: I mentioned this to Andrew Custis and he laughed and told me to assume a full day to install it. He was kind enough to offer some help saying he would be around for any advice if I end up installing as a DIY project.

I'm going to spring for the Simrad AP24 sale price (per your ref). Andrew has indicated when my R-21EC is in assembly and closer to being completed I can bring down the Simrad AP24 to the factory and he/they would take a look at the Simrad pieces and give me some advice on how best to install it, provide me with NMEA 2000 connection advice and even install some needed wires etc. The Kent factory is but 30 miles south of me.

I'm assuming as I had to do on my R-25's AP, the Simrad's Fluxgate Compass has to be calibrated, right ?

Once I understand the technical details and the install process I do have the DIY aptitude and would feel comfortable in carrying the AP24 install through to completion (so long as it's not like changing the raw water impeller on an R-25 Classic :twisted🙂.... and Andrew actually sounded quite excited about me installing the Simrad AP.24.. a cool project for sure.

Thanks for your attention and advice to my enquiries. 🙂
 
Hmmm... just got hold of a product brief for the Simrad AP24 Helm Drive Kit (Mar 2013 Rev 1.0) and it does show in one of the diagrams a connection between the S-Drive and the Autopilot Computer, but no mention of a rudder sensor in the "What's in the box ?".

IMG_0071.png


IMG_0072.png
 
Hi Barry,
I did purchase the Simrad AP24 autopilot kit from Anchor marine at $!680 and it is coming next week. The setup I have planed is the following:
Since the drive on the Simrad unit is a little longer (10") than the existing U-Flex manual drive, I don't think it is going to clear the windshield wiper motor behind the dashboard, if it is installed horizontally. So, by tilting the whole unit at a 20 degree up angle, the drive unit will fit just under the windshield motor. This is acheived by using a Teleflex 20 degree bezel on the dashboard panel, (available from Amazon) which will result in the steering shaft mounting at a 20 degree up angle, instead of being horizontal as it is now. Although the bottom of the wheel will be two or three inches higher, it will be closer to the helmsman, and If there is not enough clearance between my knees and the steering wheel, I will lower the seat a couple of inches, so that my knees will be under the steering wheel, instead of being aft of the wheel.
A rudder indicator unit is available for the Simrad AP24, which I will add later if needed. From what I can tell in the description from Simrad, it won't be really be necessary.
I hope this plan works out OK, I will keep you posted.
Cheers, Andrew
 
Andrew (Appleton): I purchased my AP24 from Anchor Express yesterday per Dave's (SGIDAVE) reference for few more dollars than what you paid at Anchor Marine. I don't have a delivery date at this time, but it's on its way to me.

Thanks for explaining the need for the Teleflex 20º bezel addition. Given this I will contact Andrew Custis ASAP about the location of the windshield wiper motor behind the dashboard and see if it can be moved to allow the S-Drive proper clearance. I really don't want to have the wheel any closer to the helm seat if I can avoid it.

Hopefully Andrew Custis can accommodate moving the windshield wiper motor behind the dashboard as my R-21EC assembly is estimated to start Aug 11. So we do have some time to alert the boat assemblers to this change. 🙂

As you have the R-21EC already, do you see that moving the windshield wiper motor behind the dashboard is something easily done by the factory as they build up the boat ?

Can you post the URL link to the Amazon 20º bezel you ordered ? Thanks... 🙂

BTW... is this what you ordered from Amazon... http://www.amazon.com/Teleflex-SB27...id=1437059768&sr=8-1&keywords=20+degree+bezel
 
andrew":3vedbv6n said:
Hi Barry,
I did purchase the Simrad AP24 autopilot kit from Anchor marine at $!680 and it is coming next week. The setup I have planed is the following:
Since the drive on the Simrad unit is a little longer (10") than the existing U-Flex manual drive, I don't think it is going to clear the windshield wiper motor behind the dashboard, if it is installed horizontally. So, by tilting the whole unit at a 20 degree up angle, the drive unit will fit just under the windshield motor. This is acheived by using a Teleflex 20 degree bezel on the dashboard panel, (available from Amazon) which will result in the steering shaft mounting at a 20 degree up angle, instead of being horizontal as it is now. Although the bottom of the wheel will be two or three inches higher, it will be closer to the helmsman, and If there is not enough clearance between my knees and the steering wheel, I will lower the seat a couple of inches, so that my knees will be under the steering wheel, instead of being aft of the wheel.
A rudder indicator unit is available for the Simrad AP24, which I will add later if needed. From what I can tell in the description from Simrad, it won't be really be necessary.
I hope this plan works out OK, I will keep you posted.
Cheers, Andrew
 
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