R-21EC Battery Charging (2009)

[Kamalani]

I found that after an overnight charging using the onboard AC charger, the House circuits were properly charged, but the Engine start battery was dead. My question, then, is does the AC charger only charge the one battery for House, and not the starting battery. I have been assuming that the two batteries were charged using a relay or combiner, but now I'm not sure. If not, then how do we make sure that the starting battery remains charged?

 

[abcandjrc]

First, it may be that someone has moved the charger output or the starter cable from what the factory originally installed. On our 2007 vintage boat the charger is a single output charger, as you indicate, but is connected only to our start battery. That makes a bit more sense in the first place. If you can start the engine, the house bank will get charged by the engine along with the start bank.

I have developed a work-around that does the job for me and also provides me with a convenient jumper cable to start the engine if the start battery has gone dead but the house battery is still strong.

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To repeat or emphasize:
My charger is connected to the start battery.
I connect the jumper for charging only when I am sure the batteries are at roughly the same, relatively good, state of charge. Typically as I arrive home from a trip and before I connect the charger to the AC. This is because the charger is just not capable of bringing both batteries up if they are both well depleted.
I remove the jumper for all normal activity since the isolator is wired to charge both batteries from the engine when it is running.
The jumper can be used to jump start the engine if either of the batteries has enough poop to pull it over.

 

[Kamalani]

Good idea on the jumper charging. Whether I am charging the Start or the house batt, I can top both off with that.

 

[abcandjrc]

Wow, you have been right on me...... I did some editing while you were responding. I think you might be wise to move the charger outlet to the start bank since that bank can get you up and running and the house bank will then take care of itself. I don't know if you bought the boat used or not, but it is possible the boat was a dock-hugger and the owner used the house bank more than he ran the engine. Then again, it may just be that someone replaced the batteries and got the wires crossed.

You should also make sure the charger and the "always on" connection to bilge pump are wired to the same bank.

Maybe some other R21 owners will weigh in saying to which bank their charger is wired.

 

[mlull]

Check the wiring on the automatic charging relay. It could be installed incorrectly. Just saying...

 

[Kamalani]

Nope - bought her brand spankin' new on factory order through a dealer. I do know that Stbd batt is labeled #1 and is wired directly to starter. Port batt is wired up to the DC fuse/distribution panel in wheelhouse. Now I just need to track the wiring from the AC charger to see if it lands on a particular batt.

 

[RProffer]

I don't know about your 2009, but my 2010 is capable of charging 3 banks of batteries. The first thing I would do is clean the battery terminals and cables with baking soda and water, then rinse with lots of fresh water. The terminals can look clean, but not be clean. Then put a battery tester on it, the kind that puts a load on the battery, to see the condition of the battery. A 3 year old battery could be getting weak. You can get a battery tester at an auto parts store.

 

[abcandjrc]

Nope - bought her brand spankin' new on factory order through a dealer. I do know that Stbd batt is labeled #1 and is wired directly to starter. Port batt is wired up to the DC fuse/distribution panel in wheelhouse. Now I just need to track the wiring from the AC charger to see if it lands on a particular batt.

That's how our batteries are located and wired to the DC side. Our charger is a Guest ChargePro 2608A-B and has only one output line. I was pretty miffed when I found that out (by a dead house battery) and did the work-around. According to RProffer's post, the factory has apparently seen the light (or at least seen that the lights will light and the engine will start) but whether in time for your boat is another question. I wish you well on that.

Here is my original thread, viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1573&hilit=+charger and the second post, by Andrew, may get you right to your situation if you only have a single-output charger. Obviously someone made the wiring switch on our boat instead of on yours ("oldtimers" or I would have remembered Andrew's comment). I would still switch to the house bank if I were only charging one bank. I bet that bunch at Wefings did the deed.... Bravo!!

To complete that thread, Promariner never responded to my question, and I obviously left the charger on the start side and built the jumper.

 

[Kamalani]

So here's the "egg on my face" part - as it turns out, both batteries were "fried"; that is, not capable of retaining a charge. One big lesson learned has been that "Maintainance Free" on a battery label does not mean MAINTAINANCE FREE. In my case both batteries had removable caps on the cells, and I should have been monitoring electrolyte levels and topping off as needed. Here in the Central valley of Calif we have summers with temps exceeding 100 deg. for extended periods. Batteries, particularly flooded, lead-acid type, don' t like this condition, and discharge at a much higher rate. In addition, these batteries had been manufactured in 2008 and then installed in our 2009 boat at the factory. All of these factors contributed to their ultimate demise.

Initially, the house batt was holding some level of charge, and I was lulled into a false sense of security that I could continue to use the jumper cables to allow engine starts. Wrong! So while tied up between two great restaurants in Newport Beach, we met the nicest guy who responded to our Vessel Assist call with a portable starting unit.

So now Kamalani is sporting two new AGM Glass-Mat, truly Maintainance-Free batteries. These are hopefully more forgiving of the hot climate, and presumimg I can keep a proper charging routine going during storage periods, they will outlast the prior flooded ones.

 

[SlackwaterJack]

My experience with AGM batteries has found them to not be entirely "maintenance free" ... Occasional dusting was needed to keep them shiny. 🙂

 

[abcandjrc]

.......One big lesson learned has been that "Maintainance Free" on a battery label does not mean MAINTAINANCE FREE. In my case both batteries had removable caps on the cells, and I should have been monitoring electrolyte levels and topping off as needed. ........

So now Kamalani is sporting two new AGM Glass-Mat, truly Maintainance-Free batteries. These are hopefully more forgiving of the hot climate, and presumimg I can keep a proper charging routine going during storage periods, they will outlast the prior flooded ones.

Yeah, "new and improved" generally means something slightly less than that. I have always popped the caps even when they were the flush, press-in types on batteries when "maintenence free" was first introduced. I soon found out that they still needed water eventually, even if charging systems were working perfectly and ambient temperatures were moderate. The only ones we never had to maintain were Prevailer Gel Cells and those had a long life as well. But also a stiff replacement price.

Did you ever assertain whether your charger has output to both batteries? As I said previously, our 2007 did not. But an earlier post today indicated that my original charger was recently "fried" by a lightening strike and I have a dual-output unit coming tomorrow. I will still carry my little jumper as referenced in my first post, above, for working around a single dead battery.

 

[Kamalani]

Now is when I show my total ignorance... the factory installed a Blue Seas Automatic Charging Relay. I'm assuming that it will sense both batteries and direct the charging to the one with the lowest voltage. (??) What I don"t know is does this ACR work when charging via the Guest shorepower charger, the engine alternator, or both?

 

[mlull]

See my earlier post on this thread. It is quite possible that your automatic charge relay was installed incorrectly. Mine was and so were others. It should charge both from either charging source unless one or more of your batteries have voltage below the relay's minimum. Google the relay to get the wiring schematic...

 

[abcandjrc]

In error.........I would still switch to the house bank if I were only charging one bank...........

Horrors!!!! I just re-read this entire thread and realized I said "house bank" in one of my several "contributions", the one with the Jun 9 5:55 date code. I still think it makes the most sense, if only charging one bank, to charge the start bank. It may be a moot point for boats built after ours since apparently a charging relay was added. It is also now a moot point for ours since I will have a two-output charger after tomorrow.