Slow or Fast

[SpaceCadet65]

Hi All. I'm a newbie here saving for a small cruising boat. The Ranger 21-EC is at the top of the list. I just turned 52 and grew up next door to the New England importer for Marine Trader trawlers back in the 70's and 80's. So I spent summers prepping teak on the new boats and getting them ready for their new owners. Some day, I thought... there would certainly be a 44' Europa model in my future.

Over the decades however, reality set in. Do I really want to maintain that kind of behemoth with all of it's systems, etc? And can I actually come up with the money for such a thing. The answer is a resounding (unfortunate) NO. But the idea of putting along at a leisurely 5-6 knots on a displacement hull with sea-kindly characteristics sipping a 1/2 gallon an hour still inspires me. Hence, my keen interest in the Ranger 21.

But as I draw closer to actually buying the boat (likely next summer), I wonder if I can actually be happy traveling at 6 knots. I have a pretty regular job which will allow me long weekends and an occasional 1-2 week trip doing short passages. At 6 knots, will I actually be able to travel far enough to see anything? I've got a few options of where to moor the boat - the South Coast of Massachusetts, or Boothbay Harbor, ME where we have a summer house. In either case, 5-6 knots limitations seriously limit the range of travel - at least until I retire 10-12 years from now and have more time.

So the idea of a 22' C-Dory has entered the mix. I can run her at displacement speeds but can get to or from at 15+ knots burning 4gph when needed (and conditions cooperate). I understand the modified dory will have markedly different handling characteristics from the Ranger, but all reports indicate a safe, seaworthy design once you know how to handle her. But a C-Dory will consume 8x the fuel, and the outboard(s) will require more maintenance than the bulletproof 3-cyl inboard diesel in the ranger.

Any thoughts on helping me make the right decision are welcome!

Thanks,

Glen

 

[Phil Nersessian]

I bought a Cutwater 30 last year and when buying a boat fuel efficiency was a major factor. Now that I own one I find my fuel costs are one of the smallest expenses when compared to maint.,insurance,slip,booze,food etc.... Having the ability to put the petal to the metal when the weather changes in a hurry is a good thing to have. That being said I am surrounded by boats that burn 2 to 4 gallons per mile that never leave the dock, so there is a happy medium. Most of the Rangers and Cutwaters have great fuel efficiency at displacement speeds (my C30 does about 6 mpg @ 7 knots?). but I like to have some speed in reserve for when I want it.So I wouldn't get to caught up in fuel burn.

 

[SpaceCadet65]

Thanks Phil. Sometimes we get caught up on one spec. Your experience of fuel const within the context of total boat ownership costs is a good thought.

Thanks,

Glen

 

[Craig]

I agree that having the extra speed when needed is a necessity in regard to safety. I would look at the under 30 ft cutwater or more specifically the new Ranger 23 amazing boat


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[tlkenyon]

Cadet,

Put your 21 on its trailer and use highway speed to cover a lot of ground in a hurry on the way to your cruising destination. Then relax at 6 knots.

We do this a lot with our 21 Classic and it really maximizes your available time.

TK

 

[SpaceCadet65]

Yeah - The 23 is one lovely boat. It does require an entirely different financial commitment - especially since it's new which rules out the used market. The sub-$50k purchase price is kind of where I'm at unless I want to wait another few years and save some more. But I LOVE the skylights in the 23 and the lovely lines of the pilothouse windows. I don't know if it's middle-age and a little tendinitis creeping into my elbows, but I'm feeling a sense of urgency recently about getting out on the water while I'm young and healthy enough to enjoy it...

:lol:

Glen

 

[SpaceCadet65]

TK- Good idea. Will have to replace the subcompact with a mid-sized SUV. Not a big deal, and will open options with a slower boat.

G

 

[tlkenyon]

We pulled our 21 Classic with a 4WD Dodge Quad with no issues. Have since got a 2500 GMC Diesel for the R25 and it pulls the 21 even easier, but is kinda overkill.

Towing also opens up a lot of more remote venues like inland lakes and more far-away destinations.

Enjoy,

TK

 

[harry ames]

See my comments on your post on the C-dory forum.

 

[SpaceCadet65]

I commute 100 miles per day - almost exclusively alone in the car. So a V8 powered, full size, truck-based platform (F-150 or the SUV derivatives, etc.) are not a good option for me in the fuel dept. But either the Ranger 21 or the 22 C-Dory can be pulled by a mid-sized SUV (Toyota Highlander or equiv) without trouble I think. It would open up options for both boats, but especially the Ranger.

G

 

[baz]

If you're unsure what your requirements will be over time (from now to forward of 20 years or so) then start small with say the R-21EC (used or new). Get a feel for this boat, its speed , its maintenance which is a breeze, its sea worthiness, its trailer ability and its overall comfort.

Note that your requirements WILL change over time.

Your changing requirements may lead to abandon boating or they may cause you to have foottitis (either -ive or +ive feet, but likely +ive feet) which makes you yearn for the longer/larger Ranger Tug models. This happened to us. We first looked at the R-21EC which happened to be alongside the R-25. Looking at both in quick succession gave us no option but to secure the R-25 because of its size, speed, comfort and looks. We kept it for 6 years and then sold it privately as our requirements and situation changed. This boat-less period lasted about a year and the Captain got restless so the R-21EC surfaced again and we purchased it brand new and will have enjoyed it for its intended purpose until end of June this year. Our requirements and situation has again changed so come end of July or early Aug this year we will be onboard with the new 2018 R-27 outboard model under our feet.

The point I'm trying to make here, is that as time moves forward you will likely find your boating requirements change. So keep this in mind. Obtain the boat that today meets your requirements and enjoy it and be keenly aware or don't be concerned too much about any misgivings you may have with it as you will have the opportunity to change boats later on that will be more suited to your future requirements. You simply cannot forecast what your requirements and/or situation will be as the future unfolds. Making a plan today will always need adjusting later on.

Good luck on your choice, and enjoy what you end up deciding on. 🙂

 

[jld]

My approach to boat buying is to first decide how fast you want to go. Charter a boat that will do 15 - 20+ knots. Spend some time running at different speeds (maybe 5, 8, 10, 15, 20 knots). Some folks find 5 - 7 knots to be a relaxing cruising speed, while others may find this speed to be unbearable. Find the speed that best suits YOU. Could be 5 - 7 knots, 10 - 12 knots or maybe you really find 20+ knots to be the most fun!

Personally, I like 10 knots for cruising with the ability to travel 20+ kph! 😀

After you decide how fast (or slow) you want to cruise, then factor in other things like how will the boat be used, do I need to trailer it, do I want to just cruise for the afternoon or for a week.

If you are concerned about the amount of fuel the boat will use, try and find performance numbers for that boat and others. The R-21 is almost legendary for the small amount of fuel she uses. This, of course, does come at the cost of slower speeds. I believe that at around 10 knots, a R-29 actually is more economical than the new R-23. The R-23, however, will do more than 30 knots and has pretty good fuel numbers at these higher speeds.

Don't rush to buy a boat. I think there is some truth to the saying, 'buy you second boat first'.

Jim

 

[NorthernFocus]

We owned a 22 c-dory for 12 years (two seasons on an older used boat and a new 2005 model) and a couple of years ago retired to a R25 classic. Some data and a few thoughts to ponder:

- We covered the same cruising area on three day weekends at 15 knots that we now take a week to see running at hull speed 90 percent of the time.
- The CD used to average 3nmpg and we now average 4nmpg on the R25. Our average trips are about the same at around 125nm.
- Higher maintenance on outboards vs diesel inboard only applies to older two strokes. On a 90hp Suzuki four stroke all it ever needed in 10 years was oil changed in engine and foot. Six years in I took it in for full diagnostics with spotless results. Had them change plugs on GP. Nearly 2000 hours (much at trolling speed) when we sold it. Buyer had full check/diagnostics done ane results were again spotless. Modern four stroke OBs are awesome. IB diesel gets (two) fuel filters, oil change, zincs, and impeller at start of season and belt every other year or so.
- we pulled up the Alaska highway plus thousands more miles on Alaska roads (i.e.mountains, frost heaves, etc.) With a Nissan Xterra and Jeep GC. I'm a pretty conservative(i.e.safety minded) driver and never felt uneasy.

The CD is perhaps the most practical boat I've ever seen in half a century on the water.

But that R21 sure looks cool.

 

[Navigator's Son]

Glen,

Your style/location for boating is going to be the best factor to determine if you want a "slow" or "fast" boat.

I had a Bayliner 265 capable of hitting well over 20 knots - fantastic boat, but I found the waters I was boating in, when not ideal for full planing, were very choppy for me running that fast (couldn't imagine how passengers would like getting bounced around for 1 - 2 hours). Most of the time I ended up having to run slower, about 10 - 12 knots anyway.

I looked at the R-23 at the boat show in January, and actually bought one - but for other reasons I changed the order and ended up with the R-25. I've taken her out on about 5 trips so far since receiving end of March - let me tell you, I don't miss not being able to run at 20+ knots. So far I've run around 10 - 12 knots. The boat sits and handles just fine in 2-4 foot waves, and in reality, I'm not looking at the clock anymore, I'm actually able to look at and appreciate the scenery along the way.

 

[olygirl]

One of the great features of the R23 is that it handles well at any speed so if you want to go slow, in between or fast you will have great handling, which is not the case in a lot of boats. We looked hard at a Sea Dory but when we compared the features, comfort, cost and overall looks with the R23 it was an easy decision to go with the Ranger. You get a lot more for your money in my opinion. The Sea Dory was literally bare walls, wires showed and the electronics package was an additional cost. While I don't intend to cruise at 25 knots (or better) on a regular basis, especially with all the logs we have around here, it is nice to know I have the speed when I need to outrun a ferry, get out of a shipping lane or get across a large body of water quickly!

 

[jld]

The sub-$50k purchase price is kind of where I'm at unless I want to wait another few years and save some more.

Going back to this post, the only boat you will find in the Ranger Tug/Cutwater line at 50K is a R-21.

The R-23 is a nice boat, but I have only seen one used on the market and that was for 110K (and I don't believe it included a trailer!)

While they don't have the shininess of a new boat, there are quite a few 2008ish R-25's on the market for 85-90K (some with trailers).

It was the R-21 with the 50K price that got me interested in Ranger Tugs. Since then, however, I have decided I want a boat in which I can do some extended cruising.

Jim