Wintering in the cold

[Irish Mist]

Eventually I hope to winter in the south but am thinking about trying to live aboard this winter in the North. Got insurance covered have bubblers and a spot in a marina where there is lots of power and fast moving water so freeze ups are few .
Has anyone been in the cold in their Ranger ? I know all the winterizing stuff so good there Just wondering more about keeping warm .. No diesel heater but lots of electric heaters
Thanks

 

[Levitation]

It's gonna be cold...
A thin piece of fiberglass with some mouse fur in the inside will not even slow the cold down, much less stop it...

 

[captain's cat]

Get some insulated jammies Mark, and for goodness sakes, don't fall in the water. I'd be surprised if some of your systems don't freeze up anyway, you might consider some 110v. heat tape. Let us know how the winter goes.

Charlie

 

[Irish Mist]

If I do it will be an adventure for sure need to decide mid Oct so will report in then

 

[SUWANNEE]

Please forgive me for going off subject as I definitely have no helpful information on your question.

But just how low does the temp get to way up there? You are referring to being where the water that the boat is sitting in SHOULD not freeze !!
I am in North Florida and when it gets below 30 degrees Fahrenheit we are COLD.
Please keep us apprised of your adventure in chill. :?
Good Luck

 

[SlackwaterJack]

I hope this doesn't get me in trouble...but I just gotta say something...don't do it.
Richmond Hill, ON.
Average annual snowfall--5 feet (61.5" or 160cm)(and that doesn't include record falls)
Average low temps from Nov 1 - Mar 31 is from -1 to -10 below freezing (doesn't include record lows), The average HIGH temps in Jan and Feb don't go above freezing.
The river may not freeze but the marina will...especially when the occasional storm knocks out power for heat and bubblers for a few hours (Marinas have a crummy history of power outages in the winter).

Living inside a frozen boat is not an adventure, it is cold, miserable and dangerous. Your boat will never be the same afterwards. Even if you manage to keep the systems from freezing even IF your power isn't interupted, you have to deal with WET EVERYTHING. Bedding, from mattress to pillow cases, simply will-not-dry. The outer "walls" will be constantly damp from condensation. electronics can be ruined by the dampness, everything that can rust. will. If the bilge pump has a frozen outlet the bilge can fill quickly. Forget about cooking...too much steam, can't shower aboard either for the same reason. The windows are not dual pane and will radiate cold and will become frosted to the point of ruining finishes and the weather stripping. You do not want to get the flu or even the sniffles in that environment.
Snow does funny things to the outside...the boat's deck is too warm to allow the snow to stay "fluffy" It melts just enough to run to a low point and freeze there...plugging any drainage and scupper. It gets under every edge and into every seam then starts its work. It is awkward and dangerous to prance around trying to shovel/sweep off the boat every other day, not to mention the damage you'll do to the boat's finish. Fiberglass cored decks do not react well to someone stompimg around on them when they're frozen. Freezing rains can be a real nightmare and can add thousands of pounds to the boat. I've slid off runways in Kingston, Toronto (twice), and was in a plane that froze to the ground waiting for takeoff in Hamilton, I know the winters there.

 

[captain's cat]

Sounds like great advice to me Jack. :idea:

Charlie

 

[Irish Mist]

Thanks for the advice . The boat stays out all winter no matter what but usually out of the water . If left in the water it would get shrink wraped to the gunnels so no snow ( slides off ) and a bit of extra protection . The interior of the boat would be constantly heated so I don't see an issue with cooking causing condensation .Showers would be a challenge involving heating drain outlet and some kind of water filtering system to use the lake water as the water tank would need constant filling... Have spoken to others who have done this on different boats for many years so have a lot of input but no one I have found has done this on a ranger. Thanks again for input as all appreciated

 

[SlackwaterJack]

The interior of the boat would be constantly heated so I don't see an issue with cooking causing condensation

Warm, moist air, condensing on ice-cold, un-insulated hull sides, and single pane windows (almost the entire cabin is window)is the cause of the problem. unless the cabin is kept at temps exceeding what most would find acceptable, there will be condensation. Leaving a boat in all winter isn't the problem as that can be done, even using it for the occasional overnite, maybe.
The boat's heater just doesn't have the output to heat the boat in temps that low, it's sized to take the "chill off a Pacific Northwest overnite. Running it 24/7 at max output for 4-5 months...I just don't know. Relying on electric space heaters at 1500 watts per the several you'll need may overtax the shore power supply and that's a breaker you don't want to pop in the middle of the night
I only mention this because I've known 3 people that wintered on their boats, One (38 foot Silverton) enjoyed it (San Diego...duh), One (30 foot catalina) almost froze (Sacramento area) and spent several weeks living in my and other's guest rooms), and one couple(50 foot Irwin center cockpit) with 2 diesel furnaces, and 8 spaces heaters constantly running, plus 20 years of full time cruising experience behind them barely made it through(Lewiston**).

** here we get an almost snow-free 3 month winter. The golf courses stay open year-round except for the odd snowday. Daily highs will usually be above zero, but it can get cold for several weeks (Jan is the only month that may average below zero for the overnite low).
If you do it, you need to find a way to insulate the cabin (over most of the windows as well) from the outside (maybe blueboard and shrink wrap?).
Anyway...that's it for my input. If you do it be prepared for record snows and lows, and best of luck.

 

[Stella Maris]

I spent the better part of two winters on Karma in the PNW. While it does not get nearly as cold here as it will in Ontario, it can be comfortable at times and downright cold at others. Maureen had made insulated window covers that we placed over the inside of the windows at night. We also had insulated covers that we covered the skylights with.

Since we did not have a diesel heater, we relied on electric heaters. I learned to balance the power needs to keep from tripping the breakers. I used two of the small West Marine Heaters as well as one of the Oil Filled Radiator heaters.

At one point, a very cold storm came through with sixty mile an hour winds (completely took out one marina just a block away), snow and temperatures down into the low teens for three days. The water in the marina froze (salt water at that). The marina was forced to shut off all running water. That meant, no more filling the water tank, to no showers shoreside as the water to the restrooms was also turned off.

On the first day, the power went off and was off for 36 hours. Thankfully I did have a generator so I was able to run it to keep the heaters going. (good thing no one else was living on the dock near me......)

We were undercover so snow was not a big issue (as long as it was not enough to collapse the roof....) but the wind did take out the covers on the next marina over.

If you want to really know what it is like to live aboard your boat in a location such as yours, I would suggest reading Alvah Simons book, "North Into the Night". Now you are not heading off to the Arctic but, after a month of the weather Jack describes, you may very well think that you had.... We met Alvah and Dinah one winter in Poulsbo. They were kind enough to join us for a glass of wine and share their story first hand. Alvah's comment when Maureen asked him what he did all day was, "try to survive to the next"!

Good luck if you should attempt this! Keep us all informed as to how it works out.

 

[knotflying]

My rule of thumb has always been, "When in doubt, don't do it". Cooking inside a closed space, besides the consumption of OX, will cause considerable condensation. Breathing causes moisture in the air. The differential between the cold hull and warmer interior will cause the moisture to condensate and will then freeze. Take a look at the boat's freezer after a few weeks of use, then multiply that by a whole boat in the winter for a looong time. You have way too much invested in this boat to take a chance of ruining it and the systems. Go south young man, go south!

 

[Irish Mist]

Thanks again for all you comments, There are quite a few people live aboard up here and swear by it ( or at it ) I would be aboard weekends and evenings, and have alternate accommodations in a pinch. Still up in the air. my plans are for small heaters in the engine room and under the floor and of course around the cabin. I have been told the shrink wrap makes all the difference. First it is a must to keep the snow off the vessel and secondly very hard to maintain cabin heat without that barrier. I will defiantly report on progress as I am hoping to go forward with this.