Yet another tow vehicle thread...

[NorthernFocus]

I've searched the forums and read most of what I found regarding two vehicles. I get the general gist from replies, bigger is better. So I have two questions:
1) How many people drive their two rigs as their every day ride?
2) Is there another whole group out there driving half ton trucks pulling R25s who just aren't speaking up?

 

[Boatdreamer]

You're going to get a lot of opinions on this topic. I tow our R27 with a F250 4X4 short bed crew cab diesel. This is my daily driver too. Great all around truck to drive in south Florida, with all our distracted drivers on the road. Our first truck was a 1/2 ton Ford crew cab with the Ecoboost and the Max tow package. This truck is rated to tow 11,200 lbs but I felt it was way to light to do the job safely, so I moved up to the larger truck with the diesel engine. Can a half ton PULL it? Sure, most have the power to do that. The bigger question should be, can a half ton STOP it safely? In most cases, yep it can. But there will come a time when you'll need to take evasive action and you will be glad you have a larger truck. I got a lot of advise from Tugnuts when I said I was towing a R27 with a half ton truck, most said DON'T DO IT and they were right. I don't think a R25 is much lighter, so a 3/4 ton is the best bet.

Tim

 

[Brian B]

I have a 2012 F350 6.7 diesel that I bought used to pull our 25SC. I bought the 350 because of the great deal I got on it, I was looking for a 250 when this one came along. I use it everyday and it gets better mileage than the Toyota Tacoma I traded in. (I did not use the Toyota to pull the boat).
I weighed the fully loaded boat and trailer on a certified CAT scale and the combined weight was 9,600 lbs. The boat has most factory options, had a full tank of fuel and water at the time. Consider this when you are making a purchase decision.
I had borrowed a Ford F150 Ecoboost to tow the boat locally. The difference between towing with the 2 trucks is like night and day.
Buy the bigger truck, then when you buy a larger Ranger Tug you will be all set up for it. 😀

 

[NorthernFocus]

...Buy the bigger truck, then when you buy a larger Ranger Tug you will be all set up for it. 😀

I may get the big truck but there is virtually no chance of the bigger Ranger. Not saying there isn't a chance of going bigger but if so it will be a truly heavy displacement boat. Been there an no plans to go back but as they say, never say never... 😉

 

[Arya II]

We have a R25SC and thought we would be okay pulling it with our F150. When we bought the boat, we met the dealer at the ramp when they delivered it, and they launched it for us. I had been dreading pulling it out, but 2 weeks ago we had to. I could barely get it up the ramp. We only live a couple of miles away and it was a stressful drive. We needed some work on the boat. There was a leak in the roof and we needed the battery charger replaced. I had to call Tommy at Seagate Marine to pick it up for us because I didn't want to chance it driving to Stuart,FL about 15 miles away. Well, long story short, Friday we traded in the f150 for a used F350 4X4. At least I will be able to pick the boat up when it's ready.

 

[walldog]

We bought a Dodge Cummings 2500 MegaCab 4x4 to pull our 27. We did over 30K towing. We traded to the R31 which we do not tow, but could if we so desired. I would not pull with anything less. We continue to use the Dodge as a daily driver, pulling it behind our motorhome.

I am glad to see that Ranger Tugs owners are responsible and safe trailer boaters with the proper equipment. Thanks for being safe out there guys.

 

[NorthernFocus]

We have a R25SC and thought we would be okay pulling it with our F150. When we bought the boat, we met the dealer at the ramp when they delivered it, and they launched it for us. I had been dreading pulling it out, but 2 weeks ago we had to. I could barely get it up the ramp.....

Presumably you're talking about a 2wd model truck? 4wd low is a wonderful thing. You could pull a house off the foundation 😀

As pointed out by others in this and other threads, moving it isn't typically the problem.

What kind of mpg do you folks with the 3/4 ton mega diesels get anyway? I can't even find any published numbers for Ford F-250. What gives with that?

 

[knotflying]

On my Chevy 3500 diesel I get 9.8 to 11 mpg when towing. I average 16 mpg between highway and around town when not towing b

 

[NorthernFocus]

On my Chevy 3500 diesel I get 9.8 to 11 mpg when towing. I average 16 mpg between highway and around town when not towing b

That's awesome. About the same, both towing and not, that we get with either of our mid-sized (gas) SUVs. Either one is about at their limits pulling our C-Dory 22 fueled, watered, and loaded for a trip.

Considering available performance data, it is interesting how close the fuel consumption is regardless of vehicle size, weight, and HP. But thinking about it a bit, even though larger rigs are a lot heavier, rolling resistance and parasitic losses in the engine are about the same as smaller vehicles. So for the larger trucks with bigger engines, a greater percentage of the engine HP is available to move the additional weight. Unfortunately the purchase cost seems to go up proportional to size/weight. That would be an interesting comparison to make. Dollars/lb of vehicle weight. Kind of like dollars/sq ft on houses 😀

 

[sc00ter]

Spoke to Andrew about towing an R25 with an F-150 or other half ton truck. Said to install electric over hydraulic brakes and I'd be fine!!!

 

[knotflying]

Spoke to Andrew about towing an R25 with an F-150 or other half ton truck. Said to install electric over hydraulic brakes and I'd be fine!!!

If you are bringing the boat short distances you may be fine, but if you are doing any towing for long distance I would be skeptical using a 1/2 ton. What you save in the purchase price of the truck you will be spending on transmission repairs and white knuckle drives.

 

[knotflying]

On my Chevy 3500 diesel I get 9.8 to 11 mpg when towing. I average 16 mpg between highway and around town when not towing b

That's awesome. About the same, both towing and not, that we get with either of our mid-sized (gas) SUVs. Either one is about at their limits pulling our C-Dory 22 fueled, watered, and loaded for a trip.

Considering available performance data, it is interesting how close the fuel consumption is regardless of vehicle size, weight, and HP. But thinking about it a bit, even though larger rigs are a lot heavier, rolling resistance and parasitic losses in the engine are about the same as smaller vehicles. So for the larger trucks with bigger engines, a greater percentage of the engine HP is available to move the additional weight. Unfortunately the purchase cost seems to go up proportional to size/weight. That would be an interesting comparison to make. Dollars/lb of vehicle weight. Kind of like dollars/sq ft on houses 😀

My observation is that if one is buying a vehicle that saves money on fuel consumption the break even point becomes negligible because of the added cost of the vehicle. Purchasing a 3/4 ton or larger with a diesel engine is more of a function of safety and towing comfort than fuel consumption . Believe me, if I could have gone with less I would have, but my towing experience told me more capacity is better. When I was on the highway and the 18 wheeler in front of me had his tire separate and I needed to hit the breaks and swerve to miss the flying debris I was very happy to have a vehicle that could automatically kick in the anti-sway system and handle it. Definitely worth the extra bucks when you are towing a boat that cost well over the price of the vehicle.

 

[Irish Mist]

I have 2013 4x4 diesel extended cab short box .. I dragged my R29 from Orillia Ontario to Ft Myers Beach with two passangers aboard and 1/2 fuel in the boat No water or waste and got average 8.5 miles per gal going down With out the boat I average 19 miles per gal city and hwy on the hwy only depending on conditions I'm low to mid 20's Cruising speed makes a diff with the diesel. Coming home from Ft Myeres I was less aggressive and averaged 9.5. I found the truck pulled the boat fine. I would have to think dual rear wheels would add some comfort to the towing but I felt totally fine with out them. My passangers on the way down commented on how comfortable they were on the trip down. I came home alone with out any issues as well
Good luck

 

[Crewdog]

We have an F250 diesel supercab, gets about 18-20 not towing, about 10-11 towing.

My daily driver is a Prius Plug-in, lifetime average mpg 91.5; current tank i'm working on is almost 160 mpg. It takes 3 kwh to recharge and our electric rate is 11 cents/kwh. on out of town trips it still gets 60 mpg.

 

[Hydraulicjump]

Can't stress enough the value of a diesel truck if you are going to travel any distance while towing. The torque of the truck, its heavier suspension, better brakes, etc. are lifesavers, not to mention marriage preservers. Add 4x4 and you will cut ramp drama in half.

But we had the same dilemma as you. So I bought an older truck--2004 Dodge Ram 2500 diesel 4x4 (3/4 ton) that had none of the emission issues of today's trucks and cost 1/3 as much. At 160k the Cummins diesel is just breaking in. The truck is not beautiful, but it is solid. I get 10-12 mpg towing. When not towing, 16-20 depending on conditions. I will be hauling our R-27 from the Bay Area to the northern end of Vancouver Island and will be glad for the big truck every mile.

But it is too big for Bay Area commutes, so I drive a very unmanly VW.

Jeff

 

[NorthernFocus]

Thanks for all of the replies, folks. Sometimes there are too many options. In my situation at least one decision is easy. 4x4 is a given. In winter I can't get home without it and definitely can't get up my driveway. I suppose I could chain up every day to/from work but that would be a bit tedious. As someone said it does remove the drama from pulling up the boat ramp.

Several people in this and other threads brought up the issue of stopping and the advantages of a bigger rig. Since as pointed out by others, lives could be at stake, I would encourage everyone to investigate alternatives in that regard. Stopping is all about getting rid of kinetic energy. With modern ABS systems that boils down to brakes. As pointed out bigger rigs have bigger/better brakes. Kinetic energy increases with weight and exponentially with speed. If you do the math assuming a 9500 pound trailer load, an F250 traveling at 65mph has 50 percent more kinetic energy than an F150 with the same load traveling at 55mph. One has to wonder whether the brakes are that much better. Of course if travel speed is a given regardless of equipment, then there is only a 20 percent difference in weight. I suspect the brakes are at least that much better. Just a thought...

 

[sidecarist]

I don't normally get into these conversations but Safety is a HUGE concern particularly in these high liability times. In short the brakes on the heavy duty trucks are indeed that much better. As you mention its all about getting rid of the kinetic energy. The critical thing to remember is where does all that kinetic energy go? It is converted very quickly into heat. If you could actually compare the brake components you would easily see the difference. The mass of the brake discs and calipers on the heavy duty trucks is MUCH greater than the half ton trucks. These more massive parts can absorb more heat for a given period of time.It's not just about disc diameter but also thickness. Caliper design also plays a big roll in absorbing the heat and preventing the break fluid from boiling. My advice after years of driving heavy trucks, and towing large loads with small trucks is use the biggest truck you can get your hands on or hire someone with the right equipment to do it. Keep you and your loved ones safe and the public will be safe as well.

 

[sc00ter]

I think it's great that a large number of responders on the site can afford a $60K truck and/or a dedicated tow vehicle in addition to their daily driver. Some folks may not be in that position though and can only afford one vehicle. I think this thread is aimed at those users.

Some folks just need to know if a truck like an F-150 (a more acceptable everyday driver) with appropriate ratings will tow the boat or not. Andrew says YES! Is that truck the BEST for towing...maybe not. But an F-350 diesel dually is certainly not the best daily driver (at least not in any metropolitan area)

That said, back to the original questions...which are:

1) How many people drive their tow rigs as their every day ride?

2) Is there another whole group out there driving half ton trucks pulling R25s who just aren't speaking up?

 

[Irish Mist]

That was why I went with non dually I do drive mine every day.. I do a lot of hwy driving and like A) the increased visibility in a higher truck and B) the safety of the truck in a collusion . As far as braking my trailer has brakes on all 6 wheels.I think you need to remember the trailer should have the ability to stop the load on it .. The truck of course helps but going back to the 1/2 vs 3/4 argument you need to look at how much towing your doing .. If just from home to a nearby lake is a lot different than across country requirements as well .Or of only the odd tow you are far better off hiring someone then investing in a towing rig. .. My two cents

 

[Boatdreamer]

On the fuel mileage question: 2012 F250 4X4 crew cab 6.7 liter diesel with a 331 rear end. We get 16-17 mpg city/highway, and about 10 mpg towing on the flat roads in south Florida. These are real numbers, not using the lie-o-meter on the dash.

Now three items for thought:

1. Deep in the Ford towing manual for the F-150 you'll find a limit on the truck and trailer sq ft you can tow. It's 60 sq ft total and the truck uses 36 of those. I'm sure a Ranger Tug is more than the remaining 24 sq ft.

2. Take a look at the data plate on the hitch itself, this number will suprise most of us. It's way less than what the truck is rated to tow. Etrailer.com will be your new best friend for a larger capacity hitch.

3. This is a biggie. You might want to check with your insurance agent to see if you're covered if you exceed the towing limits of your truck and cause an accident. Whatever truck you're towing with, make sure you know the exact towing capacity. If you bought it used, there are some websites you can find the original window sticker for your truck by inputting your vin number to see what towing equipment was installed. You might not have the capacity you think you have.



Tim