2016 Tugs and Cuts its time to replace the CO detector

[BB marine]

Yesterday I was working on the boat and installed all the 24/7 fuses that I pulled for winter storage. (CO detector, auto bilge alarm, auto bilge pump, radio memory) When I installed the fuse for the CO detector it went though the selftest but never recovered to green light. When I pulled the cover off the detector to unplug 12V and reset the unit I noticed the Manufactures date of March of 2015 and replacement date March of 2020. This is important safety equipment. I would have over looked replacement if did not happen. I know there are other threads with post about this but I thought it would be a good opportunity to post a reminder check the date on your Co detector before the end of life alarm system activates. 30 second audible and red light.

 

[palle]

I’ll check mine. Thanks for posting.

 

[Bobby P.]

Are people replacing with the same unit?
Is there a preferred or better unit?

Thanks?
Bobby

 

[knotflying]

Brian,
I thought it was good until it wasn't. Mine is now 9 years old. It was my understanding when they went bad they would start to sound a beep similar to when your batteries go real low. I have installed one of those 10 year units in the v-berth for redundancy, but perhaps it is not effective and I have a false sense of redundancy.

 

[BB marine]

Brian,
I thought it was good until it wasn't. Mine is now 9 years old. It was my understanding when they went bad they would start to sound a beep similar to when your batteries go real low. I have installed one of those 10 year units in the v-berth for redundancy, but perhaps it is not effective and I have a false sense of redundancy.

The alarm was red light and every 30 second audible. This is exactly what the End of life 5 yr. audible/visual is.

Are people replacing with the same unit?
Is there a preferred or better unit?

Thanks?
Bobby

I'll be honest. I didn't know about the end of life alarm system. The factory installed Firebox-Xintex CO has dates stamped on it. I googled troubleshooting Firebox and found the information stating it should alarm 5 years from manufacture date. The date stamped is March 2015 and March 2020. In a search for a new CO detector hard wire 12V some have end of date 5 years some 7 years. I'm replacing it with MTI 62 series surface mount. 5 year end of life alarm. This will fit in the same place has the Fireboy and cover up any marks made the fireboy. I'm not sure if this is better unit. I could not find the as found CO detector Firebox-Xintex so searched for a unit with similar or slightly larger dimensions with reviews.

 

[dfogal]

Unfortunately it does not seem to be a simple 1:1 replacement.

https://www.fireboy-xintex.com/wp-conte ... Alarms.pdf

 

[scross]

Our factory installed one in the cave was dead when we bought the boat in 2015. It was 5+ years old by then.
Bought two of these and installed one in the cave and one low in the v-berth.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Kidde-Worry ... /301683315
Inexpensive to buy, UL 2034 rated, lasts up to 10 years, super easy to install and takes just a second to check/test before every cruise!
PS: Was happy enough with the performance and size that I installed one in the cockpit of my airplane as well

 

[Red Raven]

Unfortunately it does not seem to be a simple 1:1 replacement.

https://www.fireboy-xintex.com/wp-conte ... Alarms.pdf

I replaced ours with this new unit last year. It sounded it’s end of life beeps. It is not difficult. In our case the unit is mounted down in the cave against the mouse fur and is inconspicuous so the change in shape and hole mounting is not a problem. New holes were easy to drill.

Interestingly, we had it go off repeatedly on our trip up the inside passage last year. It always seemed to be when we ran at idle speed for a long time so I thought we were drawing in exhaust somehow. Then one time I noticed my wife used her air freshener spray after using the head and the CO monitor went off! ...Problem solved. When we dropped down to idle speed that was when the head got used and the spray came out! 😀

I have no idea why the air freshener sets it off.

Curt

 

[barling]

I took pictures of my fuse blocks when I put my just purchased 2014 R31S away for the winter. I noticed there were no fuses in the top starboard cockpit fuse block where the two fuses for the two C.O. Monitor should have been. In the event the CO Monitors need to be replaced, what should be bought and where should they be bought?

 

[PanaSeaAh]

I replaced with the Xintex CMD5 single station 12/24 volt last month. Talked to the factory first to be sure of specs and choice of model. The previous model is discontinued. They indicated that mine may have been original (2009). Although there was no end-of-life signal, they indicated there may not have been one coming from that unit if it was original. If you are not sure or you can't find the date, I would replace. Too important not to. Also note that there is a MARINE version of the standard which this unit is designed to meet.

Easy replacement; screw holes line up and new unit covers old pattern in the fur in my R 25. I had to either enlarge the hole in the wall for the connectors or make space under the unit. I chose the latter, using a spacer under mounting plate to provide room for the connectors. The old plug is no longer used.

Incidentally the factory stated that winter shutdown will not affect its end of life calculation, which I believe is 7 years now. Purchased from Defender. https://www.defender.com/product.jsp?id=6504753. Life count-down does not start until the unit is activated, which is a one-time thing.

 

[BB marine]

Incidentally the factory stated that winter shutdown will not affect its end of life calculation, which I believe is 7 years now. Purchased from Defender. https://www.defender.com/product.jsp?id=6504753. Life count-down does not start until the unit is activated, which is a one-time thing.

I agree the end of life calibration is not effected by winter shut down. It also is not effected by activation. It is effected by date of manufacture. The Co detector installed in my C26 was manufactured March 2015. The end of Life 30 second audible and continual red light. Started March of 2020 when I commissioned it after winter shut down. The CO detector was not activated in my 2016 Cutwater until April 2017. I found the unit was never wired by the factory during the build. When I put all the 24/7 fuses back in after winter shut down I noticed that the CO did not selftest. I never checked it when we took delivery in 2016. When I was troubleshooting it I found that the wires were never connected to the unit behind the monkey fur bulkhead. The unit was activated then for the first time but alarmed 3 years later, 5 years after it was manufactured. I'm not sure how it is programed to do that if it is not powered all the time.

 

[snydzy]

So here is the ABYC-24 standard: https://cdn.ymaws.com/abycinc.org/resou ... 24_Pub.pdf
Pay attention to 24.6.1 requiring a UL 2034 rating on the detector...very few detectors meet this requirement..so be careful what replacement you use. Normal, cheaper household units don’t meet this criteria.

 

[Maggie Anne]

The Safe-T-Alert CO2 monitor in our R27OB was beeping the other day when I went down to the boat to do some cleanup. We had used the boat a couple of days prior but had not used the stove or anything else. The alarm was solid red with intervals of 4 beeps which indicates that it was detecting CO2. I left the windows and doors open for several hours and tried resetting a number of times but it still continued with the warnings so ultimately I cut the wires and removed the unit thinking it was defective although it wasn't that old (Jan 2017). I ordered a new unit and installed it a few days later and it came on with a green light as expected. Later, on a whim I hooked the old unit up to a 12V battery in my garage and it came up green there so not sure what the issue might have been, any thoughts?

 

[asm777]

So here is the ABYC-24 standard: https://cdn.ymaws.com/abycinc.org/resou ... 24_Pub.pdf
Pay attention to 24.6.1 requiring a UL 2034 rating on the detector...very few detectors meet this requirement..so be careful what replacement you use. Normal, cheaper household units don’t meet this criteria.

I posted about this in another thread when I replaced our two units last month with $25 UL 2034-rated ones from Amazon.

The main difference I noted with the Fireboy-Xintex is the operating temperature range with the Universal's units:

Maximum temperature limits for proper operation are 40°F to 100°F (4.4°C to 37.8°C)

vs. ABYC A-24 standard:

Design operating temperature range = -22°F to +158°F (-30°C to +70°C).

The weather here doesn't get colder than 40 degrees and I'm planning to keep an eye on the temperatures once things warm up here. If the temperatures don't exceed 100 degrees in the two locations the CO detectors are mounted, I'm good to go.

Worst case scenario, I'm out $50 for the two Universal units and will end up replacing them with the Fireboy-Xintex in the summer.

 

[snydzy]

The main difference I noted with the Fireboy-Xintex is the operating temperature range with the Universal's units:

Well, here’s the kicker:
24.9 MARKINGS
24.9.1. Detectors shall be marked with the following:,
24.9.1.1. Name of certifying body
24.9.1.2 “Marine Carbon Monoxide Alarm” or equivalent as tested to A-24,
24.9.1.3 Replace by date – MM/YYYY or
24.9.1.3.1 Replace by: XX months after retail sale as determined by the manufacturer.
24.9.2 The markings shall be clearly visible as installed.

NOTE: These markings are in addition to markings required under UL 2034, Single and Multiple Station Carbon Monoxide Detectors including the applicable sections pertaining to use on recreational boats.

Seems like you need to have these markings....which means the more pricey units like the Fireboy-Xintex.

 

[asm777]

The main difference I noted with the Fireboy-Xintex is the operating temperature range with the Universal's units:

Well, here’s the kicker:
24.9 MARKINGS
24.9.1. Detectors shall be marked with the following:,
24.9.1.1. Name of certifying body
24.9.1.2 “Marine Carbon Monoxide Alarm” or equivalent as tested to A-24,
24.9.1.3 Replace by date – MM/YYYY or
24.9.1.3.1 Replace by: XX months after retail sale as determined by the manufacturer.
24.9.2 The markings shall be clearly visible as installed.

NOTE: These markings are in addition to markings required under UL 2034, Single and Multiple Station Carbon Monoxide Detectors including the applicable sections pertaining to use on recreational boats.

Seems like you need to have these markings....which means the more pricey units like the Fireboy-Xintex.

Right. But so what? It's like buying a name brand versus a generic drug. Why pay more for the exact same product just for the name?

If the performance is the same, I personally don't care what markings are required for a manufacturer's installation. I have a sharpie and marked my units with the replacement date. =)

So, based on just the markings, I'd previously written:

Based on the above, I'm feeling pretty good about saving $150+ given that both units are built to the same UL STD 2034... and the price difference appears to be due to the markings requirements in the A-24 publication linked above that the Universal unit doesn't comply with.

I was responding to where you said:

Pay attention to 24.6.1 requiring a UL 2034 rating on the detector...very few detectors meet this requirement..so be careful what replacement you use. Normal, cheaper household units don’t meet this criteria.

Which is not exactly true. A unit that meets the UL 2034 standard may not meet the ABYC A-24 standard as I posted before in the other thread where I'd determined that it's not just the markings but that the UL 2034 standard is NOT the same as the ABYC A-24 standard which has a wider operating temperature as I shared (I had no way of knowing until after I received the UL 2034 rated units because the units I bought didn't mention anything about operating temperature in the sales listings and only included it in the documentation inside the box!).

Sharing this information so others can also make an informed decision on whether the (non-ABYC A-24) UL 2034 rated units might work in their area (where temperatures are more mild).

I'll find out myself whether I'll end up having to cough up the extra $$ for the Fireboy-Xintex units once summer and warm temperatures arrive!

 

[asm777]

The Safe-T-Alert CO2 monitor in our R27OB was beeping the other day when I went down to the boat to do some cleanup. We had used the boat a couple of days prior but had not used the stove or anything else. The alarm was solid red with intervals of 4 beeps which indicates that it was detecting CO2. I left the windows and doors open for several hours and tried resetting a number of times but it still continued with the warnings so ultimately I cut the wires and removed the unit thinking it was defective although it wasn't that old (Jan 2017). I ordered a new unit and installed it a few days later and it came on with a green light as expected. Later, on a whim I hooked the old unit up to a 12V battery in my garage and it came up green there so not sure what the issue might have been, any thoughts?

I was going to ask which model of Safe-T-Alert CO monitor you might have as perhaps it's like my Universal CO monitor that I bought on Amazon which is UL 2034 rated but can't handle as extreme temperatures as specified by the ABYC A-24 standard.

However, I just checked on Amazon and at least this model shows:

Operating Temperature: -40°F to +158°F

Thanks for the heads up on this brand of CO monitors! I'll definitely be considering them if the temperatures where my current units are installed end up exceeding the operating temperatures of the Universal units I currently have installed.

 

[asm777]

Our factory installed one in the cave was dead when we bought the boat in 2015. It was 5+ years old by then.
Bought two of these and installed one in the cave and one low in the v-berth.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Kidde-Worry ... /301683315
Inexpensive to buy, UL 2034 rated, lasts up to 10 years, super easy to install and takes just a second to check/test before every cruise!
PS: Was happy enough with the performance and size that I installed one in the cockpit of my airplane as well

I checked the manual for your unit and it seems to have the same operating temperature range as my Amazon Universal units:

40˚F (4.4˚C) to 100˚F (37.8˚C)

https://images.homedepot-static.com/cat ... 41e921.pdf

Not sure how warm it gets where you live but just keep in mind that the units might fail if the temperatures in your boat exceed 100 degrees in the summer.

 

[scross]

asm777,
We only have our boat in the water for about 60 days a year so it isn’t exposed to the higher humidity that boats that are in the water full time experience. Secondly, in the San Juan and Gulf Islands where we hang out it rarely gets above 95 degrees on the water. I would not want to be on the boat if it ever got close to either 100 degrees or 40 degrees. We are May to October boaters only. And, because these units are so reasonably priced it’s easy to put multiple units in the boat. The one in the v-berth is about 6” from my head when sleeping. No way you can miss hearing that alarm!

 

[asm777]

asm777,
We only have our boat in the water for about 60 days a year so it isn’t exposed to the higher humidity that boats that are in the water full time experience. Secondly, in the San Juan and Gulf Islands where we hang out it rarely gets above 95 degrees on the water. I would not want to be on the boat if it ever got close to either 100 degrees or 40 degrees. We are May to October boaters only. And, because these units are so reasonably priced it’s easy to put multiple units in the boat. The one in the v-berth is about 6” from my head when sleeping. No way you can miss hearing that alarm!

Great! Just putting the info out there for other folks who may not want to spend the $$ for the Fireboy-Xintex units like us. =)

Our boat stays in a slip year round and even though our air temperatures rarely exceed 80s, I do wonder if the temperatures inside the boat could get significantly higher (like how they say never to leave children/pets inside a car because the temperatures inside can soar!).

Anyway, I will find out in a few months.

Take care and safe boating!