Battery Boxes

daviduphoff

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 5, 2013
Messages
175
Fluid Motion Model
C-24 C
Hull Identification Number
RFB020260581
Vessel Name
The Mighty One (Ranger 18)
MMSI Number
338157133
I need to get a box for my batteries. It's required for insurance. Is anyone out there familiar with Century Plastics Boxes? From what I understand the purpose is to contain "gasses" so my thought is that it is ok to secure the box with screws through the bottom much like the current tray.

http://www.centuryplastics.ca/index.php ... 8&Itemid=7

Thanks for any of your thoughts.

David
 
Strange request by your insurance to contain battery gases in a box?? I would think any gases should be dissipated, not contained. Ask them if they would accept AGM batteries since they don't off-gas.
 
I agree with Dale. Unless you have a way for the gas to dissipate, similar to what is done with the propane compartment, I can't see what they hope to accomplish. Additionally, if you have maintenance free or AGM I can't see where the gas would come from.
 
David

There are plenty of folks who weld plastic so unless these need to be certified you could have them cheaply fabricated. You could even do it yourself if you are feeling energetic. (See YouTube for how to weld plastic)

As a ps I agree with the previous posts. Certainly propane has sunk a lot of boats compared to battery gases. Is insurance company aware you are diesel?

Kurt
 
Battery boxes are typically used to contain spilled/leaking fluid (battery acid), never gases. Hydrogen is lighter than air, and that's why batteries need to be in a ventilated space, so the gas will escape. Otherwise, you have a potential explosion hazard (think of the Hindenburg airship explosion).

So you don't want a gas-tight box, and you don't want to drill holes in the bottom that would allow acid to escape. Our batteries are strapped into place, so if you get a battery tray with raised edges, or a box that'll support straps, I'd think you should be good to go, without any additional screws.

I've bought battery boxes from Fisheries Supply (in Seattle, but they ship anywhere) in the past that worked out great. For examples, check out https://www.fisheriessupply.com/sitesea ... earch=true.

Jeff
 
What Jeff said!
 
Hi David,

I’m thinking you might have heard about Century Plastics battery boxes from the link on my website since I’ve never seen them advertised and they aren’t readily available through West Marine . . . so I thought the least I could do is give you this response.

In the mid 80's when I was outfitting our sailboat to go offshore, there was still a thriving West coast fishery and a lot of chandleries to serve them. You weren’t getting insurance on a commercial fish-boat without battery boxes . . . the common boxes in the Pacific NW chandleries were the Century Plastic boxes so that’s what we put on our boat. When I sold the boat 23 years later the boxes looked “as new”.

What makes them so great? They are lightweight, and compared to the ones readily available at West Marine, they take up less room, and are much stronger (I weigh over 200 lbs - if jumped up and down on one all day, I’d only hurt myself - not the box). I bought my boxes at Industrial Plastics in Victoria BC for about $30 a piece (I installed a large battery bank in my boat so I used bigger boxes; I don’t know off-hand if group 27 sized boxes - for standard Ranger OEM batteries - are available).

I was surprised at the OEM battery installation on the R27 (with the batteries strapped to an open grid in a situation where battery caustics could get at the straps and the compartment . . . and with the house batteries “paralleled” on their terminals instead of at a buss . . . so I fixed all that). There are many reasons I ultimately stuck with conventional lead-acid batteries, but that is another topic (big, and “traditionally controversial” among boaters). Suffice it to say that all batteries, even AGM’s, have vents and caustics inside.

Hydrogen gas can be an unwanted by-product of the charging process - not from the lead acid reaction that makes our batteries work, but from hydrolysis. In a properly set up system, this shouldn’t happen all that much except with over-charging. If “gassing” (as the problem is commonly called) occurs, it turns out that hydrogen is lighter than air and would escape easily through the holes at the top of the box (unlike a propane box which needs to be airtight inside the boat with a drain at the bottom for outside egress of the heavier than air gas) and thereafter out the R27's “passive” engine-room ventilation system. (You may not have noticed this “system” on your boat, but it turns out that there is a “slot” for air-exchange extending 3/4 of the way around the engine-room hidden under the cockpit combing. We decided to put an additional active “push-pull” blower on our boat, though, as outlined briefly on our web page).

I think the insurance companies (which tend to “learn things the hard way”) are more concerned with a “backup” system for containment of battery caustics; this is precisely why you don’t want to be drilling a hole in the bottom of your boxes. The boxes are traditionally “strapped down” (you can find pictures of such installations on my boat at this link: http://www.rangertugr27forsale.com/#/r2 ... utfitting/ ) ; look inside the battery boxes at West marine and you’ll find the straps and fittings that are supplied along with the boxes for this purpose.

So what “bad things” could come from caustic leaks? Well, you certainly wouldn’t want to “eat through” a battery tie-down causing a heavy battery to fly around your boat in lumpy seas. But I think the bigger worry for an insurance company is that bluish powder that you might sometimes find on the terminals of your car starter battery - that’s copper sulfate. It happens when battery caustics meet copper (not just any copper, but copper in a “charged state” . . . think “battery cables”). So in this situation, the copper is “dissolved”, then there’s not as much copper there to carry electrical current, subsequent big currents through smaller wire might make it hot, if hot enough it might cause a fire, etc. etc. .

Hope this “treatise” is of some use to you, David.

Take care,

Bob Lynch
R27 M.V. Echo
 
M.V. Echo Bob/Gay":t06v7g0f said:
I’m thinking you might have heard about Century Plastics battery boxes from the link on my website since I’ve never seen them advertised and they aren’t readily available through West Marine . . . so I thought the least I could do is give you this response.

Actually I searched google images until I found a picture of what I was looking for. After all a picture is worth a 1000 words. You would think there would be more of them out there for sale.

M.V. Echo Bob/Gay":t06v7g0f said:
What makes them so great? They are lightweight, and compared to the ones readily available at West Marine, they take up less room, and are much stronger (I weigh over 200 lbs - if jumped up and down on one all day, I’d only hurt myself - not the box). I bought my boxes at Industrial Plastics in Victoria BC for about $30 a piece (I installed a large battery bank in my boat so I used bigger boxes; I don’t know off-hand if group 27 sized boxes - for standard Ranger OEM batteries - are available).

I was looking for something that would hold 2 golf cart batteries on my 21 and the only thing I could find was the boxes from century plastics. Or perhaps I should I say after I found them I quit looking. I'm glad to know that the quality is good.

M.V. Echo Bob/Gay":t06v7g0f said:
I think the insurance companies (which tend to “learn things the hard way”) are more concerned with a “backup” system for containment of battery caustics; this is precisely why you don’t want to be drilling a hole in the bottom of your boxes.
Don't let Ranger know as the tray on my 21 is bolted down and they penetrated the tray.

M.V. Echo Bob/Gay":t06v7g0f said:
The boxes are traditionally “strapped down” (you can find pictures of such installations on my boat at this link: http://www.rangertugr27forsale.com/#/r2 ... utfitting/ ) ; look inside the battery boxes at West marine
By West Marine do you mean the clothing store on Hayden Island
M.V. Echo Bob/Gay":t06v7g0f said:
and you’ll find the straps and fittings that are supplied along with the boxes for this purpose.

I am in the process of switching insurance carriers and they wanted pictures. I'll just say the new carrier was not too thrilled with the tray that has two group 24 batteries under the engine cover on my 21. They said they needed to be in boxes and I thought the reason they said was "gasses". I'm sure that is what they said but then we all need to remember underwriters generally have no knowledge of what they are asking someone to do. Perhaps what I should do is build a tray out of starboard then set a box on it so I can strap up and over the box from the tray. When I added a 3rd battery on my 21 I put it in a single battery box that came with some plastic loops that the strap went through under the box. I'm sure they were happy with that because I didn't send a picture. 😉 Now I wonder if the $100.00 savings is worth the trouble especially since the boat is for sale.

M.V. Echo Bob/Gay":t06v7g0f said:
Hope this “treatise” is of some use to you, David.

Yes, most definitely. I'll have to look at your site

JeffE":t06v7g0f said:
So you don't want a gas-tight box, and you don't want to drill holes in the bottom that would allow acid to escape. Our batteries are strapped into place, so if you get a battery tray with raised edges, or a box that'll support straps, I'd think you should be good to go, without any additional screws.

Perhaps Ranger has stopped drilling holes in the bottom of the tray or will shortly.

JeffE":t06v7g0f said:
I've bought battery boxes from Fisheries Supply (in Seattle, but they ship anywhere) in the past that worked out great. For examples, check out https://www.fisheriessupply.com/sitesea ... earch=true.

Jeff
I always forget about Fisheries. I just bought a bunch of stuff there when I was up for the Seattle Boat Show. I did learn something at the show too. Fisheries runs a truck to Portland one day per week with deliveries. Now everyone in Portland can order that oversize stuff and have it delivered.


Now that I have opened Pandora's Battery Box I think I'll just stick with the same insurance and pay the extra $100.00.

David
 
Progressive has insured my last 3 boats and provided truly excellent service. They rate based on your car driving record - never asked any questions about the new (to me) Ranger. $625 deductible (I have a good driving record), $400k insurance, and about $1500/year. No hurricane restrictions, but they don't cover the Bahamas - only 75 miles from the US.
 
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