Bilge pump water level for C30 ?

[SJI Sailor]

I found something I didn't expect in our new C30 tonight: water in the bilge covering the aft pump. My -- perhaps mistaken -- understanding is that the pump should activate when water is an inch or two above its base (not all the way over it). Is that correct?

I activated the switch at the helm and it worked properly as far as I could tell, draining a strong stream and taking about 65 seconds to drain everything that had accumulated. Below is a thumbnail and link to a photo *after* it was drained. It's hard to tell but you can see that it is wet on top. The water was about 1 inch over the red pump housing.



I felt around and didn't feel anything unusual but did capture a few stray pieces of fiberglass in the water (as usual). As for the source, it's presumably a mixture of rain from today in Seattle and drips from the stuffing box (another issue -- dripping 2-6 drips per minute and difficult to tune just right).

I'm going to call the warranty service folks about the pump, but wanted to check here first to make sure I'm not overreacting. Thanks in advance for any feedback or commentary!

 

[Chimo]

Check the fuse for the automatic bilge pump. There are two separate circuits, one for manual activation (that you know works) and the other for the automatic. That one has an inline fuse.

Is that oil spinning off your shaft or just dirt?

 

[SJI Sailor]

Thank you, Chimo! I didn't know about that fuse. I just looked but was unsuccessful locating it ... tried to trace the wires back to the battery but am unsure where the fuse might be along the path. Here is one photo. Is it somewhere there?



Here is a new photo (this morning) showing how the pump is under water.



As for the spin-off ring that you see, I *think* that is from excessive stuffing box drips. We have been adjusting that as it breaks in (only about 14 hours so far) trying to keep that in the correct range, but it has been too loose at some points. I need to clean that up and monitor. It feels only very slightly oily.

 

[Cutwater28GG]

check the float switch and check the fuse.

the fact that it runs might indicate its the float switch and not the fuse.

 

[KennyMarrs]

Under the Cutwater factory technical bulletins there is an owner's manual for the 30s and cb. In the manual it will show you where the hot fuse is for the bilge pump. This should be a 7.5 amp fuse for your bilge pump you have installed. I believe the fuse block is inside the white hatch on the starboard side in the cockpit.

 

[SJI Sailor]

Thanks, Kenny! I will go to the boat tonight and narrow down the search for the auto sensor fuse; knowing the location should help 🙂 And also will check the size, that it is 7.5A.

Thanks, Gavin -- I will try to clean and test the switch. I'm not completely sure how to remove it (just pull?) but have found some other threads here about it. We'll see if I can solve it before the warranty folks reply; good learning to figure this out.

 

[BB marine]

Does it have the auto sensing switch that has two round sensing here is a thread.viewtopic.php?f=5&t=9508&start=0&hilit=testing+bilge+pump.

I also want to comment on the packing lubricant that is slinging out of your stuffing box. That indicates the gland might be getting warm and is to tight. After an adjustment either a touch test ( checking stuffing box temperature ) or an IR gun is more accurate. No more the 20F above water temperature after adjustment and after the packing is run in 5 or 10 degrees above water temperature. On a new boats ( I'm assuming new by 14hr comment) an initial adjustment may be needed but after that you should be able to go many hours with out touching it. I have 335 hours and adjusted the packing once. 2 to 3 drips a minute when running no drips when the engine is off.

I find that the sensor type auto switch need to have the "circles cleaned often to function properly. I cleaned them once a year but recently found out that wasn't enough. A quick wipe with paper towel does the trick. I use stork style long nose plies to wipe the faces. You may have a different style switch if yes disregard.

 

[Cutwater28GG]

looks like you have a rule pump. I have the johnson with the ultima float switch which I think Brian is also referring to. the ultima uses electrical fields to detect water level and is much more reliable. it has two circles molded into the switch to indicate the contacts.

ultima: https://www.wholesalemarine.com/joh...oliGTZioPDfGWOY9BHALhdO_aB5_cxUxoC3WoQAvD_BwE

johnson pumps that the above switch connects to https://www.spxflow.com/en/johnson-pump-marine/pd-marine-bilge-cartridge-and-ultima-combo/

you may have a switch like this on the rule pump:
https://store.waterpumpsupply.com/ruflswmo35an.html

 

[Chimo]

Looking at the photo this is the Rule automatic pump that the factory is now fitting. It doesn’t have a separate float switch but rather checks for water level every 2.1/2 minutes with a half second burst. Electrical consumption is negligible. If the pump finds resistance then it will pump until that is is gone and then turn off. Our 2017 came with the Johnson pump with the two disc sensors. I found it a pain to keep cleaning the discs. Brian had a good idea with the pliers. I tied a rag on the end of a stick. When I recently found that the basket in which the pump sits was cracked, presumably from the factory, I replaced it with the Rule automatic. So far I am really happy. The pump still has two power sources. The manual switch is a breaker on the panel by the helm. The automatic function uses the inline fuse to which I believe Kenny was referring. Obviously the location is different that on the r25Sc.

 

[BB marine]

The fuses for auto bilge pump are located in the quarter berth area in C26 I believe it is the same on the C30. There is a separate fuse panel for non- battery switched components. My panel has (2) 5 amp fuses for auto bilge pumps ( It sounds like wrong fuses were installed based on Kenny Marrs post 7.5 amp) (3) 3amp fuses , volt gauge for thruster battery, CO detector, bilge alarm, and one blank for additional CO detector. You may also have 5 amp fuses installed, possibly the reason for auto not working. May have blown expecially if you have the auto load test switches that Chimo described.

This is a photo of the fuse block. It is next to the main House 12V breaker. Disregard the vent hoses you will not have them (only pic I had) I have the panel removed in this picture.Tthere should be a cut out in the bulkhead panel has you enter the quarter berth area to get to these fuses.

 

[SJI Sailor]

Thank you again, Chimo, Gavin, and Brian! The short answer is that I found and replaced 7.5A fuses, exactly as Brian noted, in the fuse box in the quarter berth (not the cockpit).

Here are a few notes to clarify. It is indeed the Rule pump. I had been somewhat misdirected in trying to find sensors; there are no sensors on it. As Chimo noted; it turns on automatically and runs. The fuses are 7.5A as Brian notes (not 5A as the factory stated in the manual and here). They are in the panel in the cave, not in the cockpit area.

As to why both the forward and aft pumps might have blown, I'm unsure. Perhaps it is related to the stuffing box issue, so I'll say a bit more about that.

== Stuffing box detour:

After our first substantial cruise (1.5 hours, Seattle to Port Orchard), the stuffing box was dripping 60 drips a minute when off. I tightened it a bit, but did not want to overtighten. The improved it but after the return trip it was still 20 drips+ when off.

A warranty technician came (mobile general tech, not factory, for our service on Cutwaters). He stopped it, but when I next started the boat and put it in gear, I could detect 0 drips. So I loosened it slightly until it dripped. However, it then dripped again when off. Repeat this a couple of cycles. At some point along the way, it slung out the lubricant as Brian noted, although some of that was present at delivery.

My tentative conclusion at the moment is this: advice to have it *drip* when running may be imprecise, because it may not visibly drip. Instead, the cooling water may run down the bottom side of the shaft. So I'm working under the assumption that (1) it should be *wet* and/or visibly dripping, and (2) to check the temperature with IR gun (which I've done while testing, and it is indeed within 20 degrees of water temp, i.e., haven't seen it above 74F here in Puget Sound). And I've cleaned up as much of the lubricant as was practical, eliminating the oiliness of the bilge.

== end of detour

Bottom line: it's working now, thanks in big part to the pointers from all of you!

We will monitor and hopefully the fuses won't blow again for a while. I am worried about both of them blowing, but maybe it was a one-time thing. Besides the stuffing box issue, I have found lots of stray objects in the bilge from construction (screws, fiberglass, cable tie, pieces of wire, etc.)

 

[asm777]

Glad you were able to get it resolved!

I try to make it a habit to check the bilge before and after each outing to make sure both the shaft isn't dripping excessively and also that the auto bilge pump is functional. (Pour some fresh water into the bilge after washing down boat and should see it activate - our pump has sensors so not sure if that would work on yours).

Regarding the prop shaft drifting, be careful not to overtighten as you can strip the brass screws and will have to replace the hardware (learn from my lesson learned the hard way!) =)

This thread was helpful when I was dealing with leaking prop shaft. We replaced the shaft packing 3 years in and are planning to do so every few years as a preventative maintenance measure:
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5372&start=15#p72755

A suggestion, get a two liter soda bottle and cut off top and bottom and open along the side so that you can slide it over the prop shaft. Our dealer taught us this little trick and it keeps the drippings from being slung all over the inside of the engine compartment. You can see that our 2 liter bottle cover collected some burnt material in the above linked post.

Hope your troubles are behind you and happy cruising days ahead!