bio-diesel

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tim&kim

Active member
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Aug 30, 2009
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Fluid Motion Model
C-248 C
Vessel Name
"big attitude"
When fueling up "big attitude" yesterday I was told by the dock fellow that this would be the last time for "straight" diesel since it has been mandated in British Columbia that all of our diesel must now be a min of 5% bio-diesel effective Jan.1.
He warned of potential "problems" with filters, tank scrubbing etc. as a result of the "bio" component.
Would there be official advice and or statement/position on this from Cummins and Yanmar for those folks?
Is there an additive we should be using in conjunction with the "bio" diesel?
What are the potential problems we may see, if any ?
Thanks !

Tim & Kim
R25-"big attitude"
Gibsons, B.C.
 
Here is one thing i found on the web. I will keep looking.

Alternatives to diesel fuel are a hot topic currently. And one of those alternatives is biodiesel (BD) — made from biological sources rather than crude oil. One of the drawbacks to using BD in a marine engine, however, is the careful position of many engine manufacturers. Since BD can cause damage to some seals and gaskets, engine owners who used BD might cause problems for their engine and void their warranty.
Now International Boat Industry is reporting that Yanmar Marine has approved B5 biodiesel as a fuel for most of its recreational marine engines. The specific fuel Yanmar has approved is a mix of standard diesel with no more than 5 per cent B5 BD. The mix must conform to ASTM D6751 or ISO EN14214 specs. And to prevent damage to system components, BD-compatible parts have to be fitted.
A small move forward, but a possibly a significant one. And it should mean that soon you'll notice the aroma of cooking french fries while on the water.

Posted from Ocean Navigator Online Blog
 
Tim,
First step.... move to a location that offers straight diesel...... oop's that would be down here with us.....

Seriously though, Passagemaker Magazine has done numerous articles in the past about this very subject and some of the issues that can be caused by the use of Bio Diesel. The biggest concern as I understand it is the gumming effect that can happen from the "bio" portion of the fuel. This gumming will clog filters and lines if not taken care of. The gumming is caused by sitting for long periods of time in the tank. Now, if you use your boat regularly you may avoid this. We did put one tank of bio diesel through Solitude. She smoked more and smelled like a McDonalds (most bio diesel is made with rendered oils from restaurants etc.). This was the one time that we went hard and fast to burn this tank up as quickly as possible.

Now, if you get the 29, you will not have to worry about the gumming effect. We have 53 hours on Karma now and have burned more fuel than we did in Solitude in 250 hours. Problem solved! Buy the 29! Burn the fuel faster. No gumming!

I will say, I prefer to use bio in my Dodge pickup with a Cummins as it gets better mileage and actually runs better. We have not had any issues with gumming or anything else. We do not drive our truck a lot as we both have company cars that we can drive a no cost. A tank of fuel in my truck will last up to two months.
 
Hey David,
Did you find that the 29 held true to the specs on the fuel burn?

Happy new year, Stuart
 
Stuart,
We did find that it held true. We have averaged 4 gallons per hour at an average speed of 8.5 knots. We do run it up to 85% load at the beginning to heat the oil. Then through out the cruise, we will run it up to 85% for ten to fifteen minutes. At the end, we try to get in at least ten minutes at 85%. The rest of the time, we are at 65% of load which equates out to eight knots. We are not dissatisfied with the fuel burn as we are running faster and pushing more weight. Overall the boat has performed better than expected. Six to seven foot sea's...... It did great! We are already talking about the "next" Ranger Tug!
 
Thanks David,
That is good to here. I have also been wondering how she would do in rough seas. It sounds like you are very pleased. I do have to ask you to explain the next ranger tug? :?

Stu
 
I do notice that the Cummins list does not show the QSD series engine used in the the R25...
So, is it NOT approved, or does Cummins not consider the QSD to be 'their' engine?
Inquiring minds and all that...

denny-o
 
Stuart,
When you are a guy like Dave Livingston, your mind never stops looking forward. He started with a 21, added the 25, then the 29 came along. As long as Dave can design, I think he will continue to add to the growing list of Rangers. I could see him launching something in the mid 30 range in a few years. Remember though, that is my speculation. Again, I do not think Dave will ever rest when it comes to designing boats anymore than anyone of us will rest when it comes to playing on our boats........

Again, we are very pleased with the way Karma handled the rough water. No pounding, shuddering, creaking, leaks, etc. The only noise was the items that had not moved at all in any of our previous travels, falling over, The chart book would not even stay on the table! It kept falling off! We had the prop cavitated twice as the stern got lifted by a wave or two!
 
Hey David,
Ok that makes since, and that is what i thought you meant but just wanted a bit of clarification.

I will use our 29 in the winter months around the channel islands area from time to time. It can really kick up around there.It is common to have a 8 to 12 foot swell at 10seconds or less and a 3 to 5 chop on top of the swell. it makes for a real rock and roller kind of adventure.
It is good to know the ranger can handle it. When I asked the boys at ranger about how it does in rough seas they said that the boat could handle more then you could.
I would imagine that your fuel burn was a bit more during the rough seas due to the boat working harder. How would you say you have the boat loaded? Have you put a lot of extra weight on it other then full tanks and maybe a tender and personal effects. I would think it just being the two of you it would not be much.
They are starting to build ours next. Yes we are pregnant with a 9200 pound mid night blue baby girl. Her name will be Spirit of Gratitude. With an expected delivery date of 3/10/10. Oh boy and oh s#%t at the same time. It is really true. Life is too short to not be doing what you love.
Still looking for your pics. I know you have been very busy playing around the PNW and all but lets get busy with the upload. He He Ha Ha. Also would love to see some pics from your trip.

It is really good to here how much you love your boat. I know it will not be long before we will be sharing the same feelings and spreading the good ranger word.
Stuart
 
Stuart,
The fuel was 3/4, water full, waste 1/2. At this time we do not have a tender, only the kayak. We do have more ground tackle than most would carry, three bruce anchors each with 100' of chain and two hundred feet of line. Along with the anchors I have six shore lines that are 200' long with 25 feet of chain on the end (to wrap around boulders or trees if needed)

We have the genset plus the AGM batteries that weigh more than the standard wet cells. We also have a portable freezer that comes in around 80 pounds. And then there is the wine....... gotta have the wine....... couple of cases on board. I would have to guess with all that we have added, we have an extra 1000 pounds on board...... Our rate of burn was actually lower in the rough water as we were only making 8 knots. Crossing the strait we ran at 15 knots. Wanted to get across as fast as possible.

Again, Karma did great, Maureen was ready for a drink once we got her tied to the dock though..... Maureen had the helm through it all.

One thing I would suggest is you get a couple of twelve volt fans to aid in defogging the windshields. It was quite a balancing act to keep reaching across the dash while bashing through the seas so Maureen could see where she was going.

I will try to load pictures again this weekend. Hopefully they will take.....
 
The only diesel fuel, until the last of December, available in our community was bio-diesel. The last week of December the largest supplier of bio-diesel in the area--Farm Supply--removed all bio from their bulk dispensing tanks. They had a big sign on the billboard saying "NO BIO IN OUR DIESEL". My guess is there was a bio-diesel problem and they were attempting to ally fears of their product. Bio-diesel, from what I understand, has a tendency to gel more so than straight diesel. Many oils and greases can be refined for diesel but some mixes tend to solidify more in cold weather. FS,according to their manager, was using an 11% mix of a refined soybean oil. Some of the other stations in town did not know what their mix or % was--only comment I could get was "it's whatever the truck delivers". BP's label on the pump states that the bio-diesel is "Not a BP product"--it's purchased from a contract supplier-i.e.- cheapest, using who knows what for the bio portion.

The whole thing is scary considering being stranded, be it on the water or highway.

If I anyone cares to correct me or explain it better, please do.

Tuggin Aweigh
 
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