Cautionary Tale

D

DaveP27

Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2016
Messages
22
Fluid Motion Model
C-28
Vessel Name
Tugether
Hello everyone. Just wanted to share my misadventure to help prevent yours! I have been in the habit of travelling with my 12 foot kayak propped sideways lodged between the propane locker and swim platform rails on my RangerTug 27. It fits perfectly and has never been a problem until ....

I was headed home from a great weekend on the boat and just ahead of a storm with some choppy conditions on Tampa Bay. Somehow the chop and wind were just right to allow some wave action to splash onto the ends of the kayak creating some splash-back into the cockpit. Before I realized it, my engine compartment was more like a salt water dishwasher. The scuppers were obviously not able to keep up with the waves splashing in. I was able to correct the issue and bildge out the compartment and get home OK without any problems at the time. But salt water has a way of corroding everything it touches. Despite liberal use of anti-corrosion spray I'm losing the battle.

So far this mistake is costing me a new starter, alternator, autopilot controller and AC raw water pump. I hope that's the end of the list!

My advice, be very careful with anything on the swim platform while under way that might extend beyond the beam of the boat. It doesn't take much to get swamped in the right conditions.
 
That's a really interesting heads up! Thanks. Our R25 is new so I haven't had much sea time in the last weeks but I was wondering about wedging the zodiak on the swim platform. maybe not a good idea in rough conditions.

Do you keep the strainer discs in the scuppers? I believe that many have removed them.

I have had more than a foot of water in the cockpit of a 23 Boston Whaler (my own fault, backing down in a 3ft chop)). The scuppers were working hard but opening the door at the stern really helped. That drained fast. Do you think this would have been a good move on the Tug or an invitation for more water to enter?

Thanks
 
I still have the strainers in the scuppers, but had they been out maybe I would have been in better shape. I worry that taking them out might clog the drains with debris. I have a lot of seagull feathers, bone fragments from seagull meals and dirt in my scuppers that I clean out regularly. I checked them and they do seem to drain well. But I'm sure they would drain faster without the strainers. Maybe I'll take them out when I'm underway. And put them back when boat is stored in wet slip.

There wasn't any water on the cockpit deck when I went back out to troubleshoot. Not sure if there was ever enough water to let out the cockpit door -- I hope not!

If your zodiak doesn't extend beyond the beam of your boat I think you'll be ok. My kayak stuck out about a foot on both side sand that's where it was catching some wave action.
 
I removed my drain grates after one month of ownership. Never had an issue with the drains getting clogged with debris. My routine maintenance is to always shoot water with a hose down the drains and clear debris from the flappers as the water exits.
 
This caution not only applies to carrying a kayak in an inappropriate way, but also any wave action, frontal or rear, for the r25 and r27. The cockpit is technically not sealed towards the below areas nor in some section toward the cabin. There is a gap to the port side of the cabin door that would lead to water intrusion into the main cabin if the cockpit was filled at least 30-40 percent in height. The hatches to engine and other storage compartments are not water tight. We can learn from lake oroville that if you have an opening that allows more water in than the opening that lets it out you have a deficiency 🙂

While the tug can take a beating better than the people in it, caution needs to be applied when you are in conditions that allow green/blue water over the bow (or the cockpit walls) flow into the cockpit. Been there on my sail boat, and it helped to have clear run off paths for the water without the tub characteristics 🙂
 
This sounds more like a design or construction flaw to me. If splash back action from a couple of kayaks is more water than the scuppers, gutters and hatch gaskets can handle then a downpour from a heavy rain would certainly flood the engine compartment also. Or even a focused wash-down around the hatch from a hose. Sounds like one good wave from the stern could easily disable the boat.
 
Were the automatic bilge pumps working? Sounds like an incredible amount of water in the boat to get to the starter, alternator without the pumps coming on. Do you routinely manually check the automatic function of the bilge pumps?
 
We have been in some sloppy stuff in our R27 and never had any water overflow from the scupper system into the bilge. Like spray over the top of the boat and water hitting the front windows in sheets. The first thing our dealer said about the scupper system was to lose those plastic strainers. When at home we use a slant top canvas enclosure to keep the cockpit clean and dry. We have a complete cockpit enclosure when we are on the water which keeps spray and rain from getting into the cockpit. It's makes for a nice place to hang out in the rain or if its windy and cold out. 22 and 23' C-Dory's don't have self draining cockpits; no drains or scuppers. You don't hear about many of them sinking. If you take that big of a wave over the stern you should not have been out on the water in the first place. Staying on the back side of big waves is usually my plan for those kind of conditions if possible in running an inlet during ugly conditions. IMHO. I think Ranger Tugs are pretty sea worthy from what I have seen anyway.
 
Our boat was delivered without fuses in the bilge pumps. Water collected in the bilge and one of the transmissions solenoids was destroyed causing us to quit running in the middle of the Tennessee river. Our paddle board carried back there will catch the water too when we are going fast so we just bring into the cockpit. Will your insurance help you with this?
 
Jake":19x3mevp said:
This sounds more like a design or construction flaw to me. If splash back action from a couple of kayaks is more water than the scuppers, gutters and hatch gaskets can handle then a downpour from a heavy rain would certainly flood the engine compartment also. Or even a focused wash-down around the hatch from a hose. Sounds like one good wave from the stern could easily disable the boat.
Click to expand...


Not a design flaw, but a limited envelope. Products are designed for a certain environment in mind. If you exceed that envelope you will get different, sometimes unwanted results. Knowing those limitations are critical to a safe boating
experience.


Just look at the numbers. The cockpit is about 50 sqft, a a water height of 1-2 ft int he cockpit are 50-100 cubic feet of water. How long do you think it takes for that water to run out of two scoop with an , i think 1 1/4 or 1 1/2 diameter.
Before that happens water will have entered other spaces.

The primary goal is to NOT get 50-100 cubic foot of water delivered into the cockpit at a rapid rate. The cautionary tale
was, as I read it, causing more than some light spray from the protruding object across the swim platform, more then the
two scupper could carry away. Its just physics, volume in should be less then volume out, or volume will look for other ways out 🙂
 
Yes. Exactly. That was my point in posting. Don't put anything on the swim platform that might extend past the beam of the the boat as it can scoop large amounts of water into the cockpit under certain condition. My mistake. Don't let it be yours!
 
Scuffy":24n99cl1 said:
We have been in some sloppy stuff in our R27 and never had any water overflow from the scupper system into the bilge. Like spray over the top of the boat and water hitting the front windows in sheets. The first thing our dealer said about the scupper system was to lose those plastic strainers. When at home we use a slant top canvas enclosure to keep the cockpit clean and dry. We have a complete cockpit enclosure when we are on the water which keeps spray and rain from getting into the cockpit. It's makes for a nice place to hang out in the rain or if its windy and cold out. 22 and 23' C-Dory's don't have self draining cockpits; no drains or scuppers. You don't hear about many of them sinking. If you take that big of a wave over the stern you should not have been out on the water in the first place. Staying on the back side of big waves is usually my plan for those kind of conditions if possible in running an inlet during ugly conditions. IMHO. I think Ranger Tugs are pretty sea worthy from what I have seen anyway.
Click to expand...

Good comments here. Hope you don't mind me adding.

We just moved from the 23 Venture C-Dory and can testify about the "feel" being different. Before we bought the tug someone commented on this site that we were going to a vessel that tended to go through waves rather than to bob over the top like a cork. That is certainly true. We also used to have the slant top canvas enclosure on the C-Dory for when it was left out in the open and if it was really rough weather I used to snap this on while we were going along. That stopped any water from splashing into the cockpit. It probably wouldn't have stopped a wave coming over the stern but it did add a measure of security. We never had the complete cockpit enclosure. We certainly went through some interesting conditions and never felt unsafe in the C-Dory. I certainly don't have enough experience with the tug so far to use the word "never".

All that being said I would not knowingly take either boat out in the conditions that I would run in the Boston Whaler. As I mentioned in my earlier post it was my own stupidity that dumped a lot of water into the cockpit on the 23 but it was easy to open the door, hit the gas and watch everything flood out of the stern and out through the big scuppers. There is something really comforting about being "unsinkable". I can't testify that a Boston Whaler has never been sunk but before the relatively recent use of RIBs they were the gold standard for both the military and SAR.

Note that I am now older, possibly wiser, and seeking for more comfort. I am really enjoying in the Ranger Tug and have no desire anymore to go fast or go airborne. Maybe I'm growing up? 😉
 
I removed the scupper filters many years ago with positive results (i.e., no/minimal clogging). You do need to check them, but I found that with the filters they were constantly clogging and I was checking them all of the time. If there is any clogging, just stick a hose in the opening and turn on the water to flush it out. It was well worth the change. I did get a lot of water in the bilge one year, but it turns out one of the scupper drain hoses was cracked. It was something you couldn't actually see, but when you ran a hose into the drain the leak was obvious and was letting a ton of water into the bilge. It was an easy fix. I also went around each cockpit hatch and doubled up the seals. This also made a big difference. Now the only water I really get in the bilge is from the drip of the propeller shaft seal, even in rough conditions when a lot of water is coming into the cockpit.
 
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