Cell phone booster

[Hydraulicjump]

There are lots of older threads on this, but there are so many newer products I thought it worthwhile to consult the Tugnuts braintrust before purchase. We are in a marina with spotty AT&T cell coverage and we work from the boat a ton in the PNW.

Just curious to see who is pleased or displeased with their booster before we buy.

Thanks.

Jeff

 

[iggy]

I am from the Boston area, but.... I hear that all the time about other cell companys. I have Sprint and don't have that problem.

 

[Capt’nKarl]

We bought the weBoost RV/marine version from Wilson about a year ago hoping it would help will cellular connection. The unit was about $500.00. Our experience using it while camping, on the road or on the water has been very disappointing. We recently used the system post hurricane Sally. We had a 2 bar cell signal without the cell booster so there was a signal. Using the cell booster with the outside antenna raised to 25 feet there was no appreciable change in the signal strength nor was there any appreciable change in download speed. We have used the Wilson weBoost in a variety of conditions but have never seen any significant improvement in signal strength. For $500.00 IMO it’s just not worth it but since I already have it I’m going to upgrade the outdoor antenna to see if this helps but haven’t made that happen yet.

 

[Hydraulicjump]

Thanks. This is just the kind of intel I was looking for. I worry that these are more hype than helpful. Again, appreciate the help.

Jeff

 

[vertigo]

I'm using the WeBoost with the truckers' antenna mounted on the kayak rack on our R29, and a Netgear mobile hotspot for our AT&T cell service. Before I added the booster, browsing this forum while sitting in Fossil Bay as Sucia Island was an exercise in futility. But now we're streaming movies seamlessly. With the gear, we're seeing 3.5-8 Mbps downloads. Without it... "error".

It's made a big difference for us, enough so that the admiral has now greenlighted a plan to move up to a bigger boat and live at least half-time on the water. Easily worth many times the expense!

 

[Hydraulicjump]

Thanks. When it comes to antennas, everyone seems to have a different experience. How did you bring the antenna cable into the cabin? I am loathe to start drilling holes in things.

Jeff

 

[Capt’nKarl]

We run the outside antenna cable through a window and into the cabin. No holes drilled. The indoor antenna has about 10 feet of cable so you can place it almost anywhere. Our experience using the WeBoost RV system, which has not been very positive, has been the closer you place your devices to the indoor antenna the better signal strength you get. I think our issue with this system is even with a 1-2 bar signal strength(without the booster) the outside antenna does not add any significant strength to the signal which is why we’re going to upgrade to the trucker antenna to see if that helps.

 

[vertigo]

Thanks. When it comes to antennas, everyone seems to have a different experience. How did you bring the antenna cable into the cabin? I am loathe to start drilling holes in things.

Jeff

We drilled a small hole in the side of the "stack", installed a small Hubble clamp fitting, and snaked the antenna cable through the headliner in the cabin to the bulkhead above the helm, with the inside antenna positioned midship port above the curtain valance.

 

[Danation]

Check out https://www.mobilemusthave.com/ and the Pepwave router bundles. These routers have their own sim cards to get cell service with boosted wifi too. I'm looking a Pepwave router with a 5 in 1 Mobilemark Antenna on the radar mast if I can figure out how to route the wire down through the roof to the electrical panel. The Mobilemark antenna is pretty compact.

There are lots of older threads on this, but there are so many newer products I thought it worthwhile to consult the Tugnuts braintrust before purchase. We are in a marina with spotty AT&T cell coverage and we work from the boat a ton in the PNW.

Just curious to see who is pleased or displeased with their booster before we buy.

Thanks.

Jeff

 

[Jeff Messmer]

I also use the We Boost for RV and Marine. Our experience has been similar to Vertigo. We went from a futile attempt to make a phone call to full bars of LTE. It does not work if there is zero cell coverage, and you do need to be right next to the internal antennae for maximum boost. I have also found that the internal antennae cannot be right next to the booster. It needs to be 6-10 feet away for best results. We also ran the cable through the window. No holes drilled. The We Boost also works with all cellular carriers.

 

[Hydraulicjump]

Thanks Jeff. When Tugnut#1 says something, I pay attention. Ordered one and will report on how well it works when on the boat later this month.

Jeff

 

[batate]

I got the mobile must have road warrior bundle with the pep wave max transit 2, the poynting, and added the ATT plan. I will install it in the coming week for our loop run, and report back on how it goes. We're installing it on a 2014 R29S. We're dropping the TV antenna in favor of the wireless. I'll be working aboard at marinas and sometimes at anchor, so I need reliable service.

BTW, I am new at this, but this resource is fantastic. Thanks to all for sharing your knowledge.
- Bruce and Maggie

 

[Submariner]

I've been working on this issue for most of this past boating season.

I started out earlier this year purchasing a Peplink MAX BR1 MK2 LTE/WIFI router with a Peplink Mobility 22G antenna. I mounted this inside the boat using an ATT SIM card. It did 'ok', but not fantastic like I'd hoped. (I'd see about 30mbs). But then again, please consider that I'm looking to be at anchor, away from a marina and have great LTE/5G connectivity for work. I then added a T-Mobile sim to the unit and that helped. However... technology changes, constantly.

My current winter project is going to solve this issue for me of "WFB" (work from boat).

I just bought a Pepwave MAX BR1 Pro 5G (I pre-ordered it as it's brand new, and just arrived last week!!).
I also bought a Pepwave Mobility 42G high gain antenna that's also very new tech! I'm going to remove the Majestic TV antenna and replace that with the Mobility 42G antenna up on the mast. That location is high up on the boat, out of the line of radar, and should provide the best cellular data coverage possible.

I'm going to drill a 1 inch hole through the roof of my boat to route 7 antenna cables down the mast!
(4 LTE antennas, 2 WIFI antennas (2.4ghz and 5ghz) and a GPS antenna. The Mobility 42G is a 7in1 antenna. The 6 cables all go into the MAX pro 5g router. The GPS antenna I'm going to connect to my Vesper AIS XB8000.

The MAX BR1 Pro 5G has the capability of achieving over 400mbs of real-world cellular data connectivity. (what you could see on an actual speed test). I don't need cellular voice as voice calls are ran over the LTE/5G data connectivity. (Voice over LTE) So long as I have great data connectivity I'll have a fully functional phone.

The high-gain antenna (Mobility 42G) is specifically designed to re-shape the antenna pattern, to flatten it out, increasing power by reshaping that signal more horizontally (towards land) instead of up into the sky. You can't necessarily increase power, but you can take the power you have and concentrate it in a specific direction. Think of a flashlight, as you adjust the beam of light from very wide to more focused you get a more intense beam of light pointing a specific direction.

For the San Juans Islands, T-Mobile is going to be your best bet. I spent the money for 5G as T-Mobile purchased the 600mhz frequency in 2017. In 2019 they started deploying it. It's unique to T-Mobile currently. They bought this frequency at auction against the other carriers specifically for rural America. The lower frequency is able to go farther than higher frequencies. With the newly acquired 600 MHz spectrum, which will broadcast as band 71, T-Mobile will be able to deploy far-reaching signals with greater bandwidth across the entire US.

Having multiple SIM cards is also a requirement. I have ATT (100gb/mo) and T-Mobile (50gb/mo). This is necessary for diversity. When we head North into Canada, and ultimately into SE Alaska, ATT is going to be the dominate carrier up there and will yeild better connectivity than T-Mobile. The MAX Pro 5G supports 2 SIM's but only has 1 modem. It can pick and choose which carrier to use based on current signal strength, as well as billing options (how much bandwidth you've used this month).

The Mobility 42G antenna offers the following gain per frequency range. Note, 3dBi of gain doubles the power.
2.7dBi: 617-960MHz
5.2dBi: 1710-2700MHz
4.9dBi: 3400-4200MHz
6.7dBi: 5000-6000MHz

As I boat around the San Juan Islands I'm looking at various indicators of cell coverage. RSRP, RSRQ, SINR. If you have an iPhone, disable WIFI then dial this number: *3001#12345#* and it'll open up your LTE/5G stat's on your phone.

RSRP >= -80 is excellent. -80 to -90 is good. -90 to -100 is mid-cell. <= -100 is cell edge (poor).
RSRQ >= -10 is excellent. -10 to -15 is good. -15 to -20 is mid-cell. < -20 is cell edge (poor).
SINR >= 20 is excellent. 13 to 20 is good. 0 to 13 is mid-cell. <= 0 is cell edge (poor).

The Pepwave MAX BR1 MK2 and the Pro 5G both have a nice dashboard which also shows RSRP, RSRQ and SINR. This helps me better understand the cellular connectivity available at an anchorage. The reason we all struggle on the water with connectivity is that the tower has a lot of power to get that signal to you. But the power and antenna setup on our phones offers much less range on the return from the phone to the tower.

In addition to offering LTE/5G connectivity, the MAX Pro 5g (and the MAX BR1 Mk2) also offer WIFI connectivity to guest WIFI at marinas. We've used this feature a lot actually. Save the data on our cell plans when moored as a guest at a marina and bring in marina guest WIFI to the boat via the high gain antenna.

I've also been talking a lot with Doug over at Milltech Marine. AIS and both wireless solutions I've purchased through Doug.

We named our boat Channel Surfing because we don't watch a lot of TV. We'd rather be out surfing channels on our boat! We are replacing the TV antenna with a robust LTE/5G wireless solution so we can venture off further and still stay connected. I'll be picking up a ROKU for the TV as they only require a USB port for power (low power requirements), and then we can relax in the evening at anchor and watch YouTube, which we watch a lot of. (hard to believe, eh? 🙂 )

PS. If anyone would like to purchase the MAX BR1 Mk2 with a Mobility 22G antenna, I'll cut you a sweet deal on it. 🙂

 

[Submariner]

Here's some links to check out to go with my previous post.

What I'm installing on my boat.
Pepwave MAX BR1 Pro 5g
https://www.peplink.com/products/max-br1-pro-5g/

Pepwave Mobility 42G 7in1 high-gain antenna
https://download.peplink.com/resources/pepwave_mobility_42G_datasheet.pdf

I'm installing the above because of this (note: Article is dated Jan 2019)
What T-Mobiles Band 71 Means for its Subscribers
https://www.maketecheasier.com/what-t-mobile-band71-means-for-subscribers/

For installation of the antenna, extending the antenna cable degrades power by a lot. It's best to put the router as close to the antenna as possible. The Mobility 42G antenna came with 2 meter cables. I will not be extending them. I'm installing the Pepwave MAX BR1 Pro 5g to the ceiling, centerline. Screwed into the teak, upside down. Mostly as forward as it can go up there. I will have to drill a couple more holes to route the antenna cables through the teak to connect to the router. I already have 12volt power there. It's labeled "spot light", which I don't have. But Ranger Tug was nice enough to at least run the 12volt power for a spot light and left the cable at the base of the mast, inside the boat, above the centerline teak. I'll wire in a push button on/off switch as well.

MAX BR1 Pro 5g router is going here on my boat.
http://www.tugnuts.com/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=81335

Mobility 42G antenna is going here on my boat.
http://www.tugnuts.com/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=81339

Antenna cable routing
http://www.tugnuts.com/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=81345

What's under the centerline teak.
http://www.tugnuts.com/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=81342



The original setup I started with:
Pepwave MAX BRI MK2
https://www.peplink.com/products/max-single-cellular-br1-mk2-router/

Pepwave Mobility 22G 5in1 high-gain antenna
https://download.peplink.com/resources/pepwave_mobility_22G_datasheet.pdf

My original setup installed on my boat (No holes drilled anywhere)
http://www.tugnuts.com/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=81348

Same thing, but incognito.
http://www.tugnuts.com/gallery2.php?g2_itemId=81351

 

[batate]

I installed the max transit duo. We're using both verizon and att data plans. We're getting internet just about everywhere, but in some places, the uploads are just about intolerable.

Installation wasn't bad. We did take off the satellite track vision antenna in favor of the pointing 7-1 mimo. We took off the ridge cap and drilled a new hole and added a clam shell with 5200 in it to seal the antenna. We made sure to dip the screws in bedding compound before reattaching the ridge cap. No leaks.

We mounted the unit in the small storage above the captain station to keep the cable run short. That made it easy to route the antenna cable just aft of the TV assembly and in through the back of the storage compartment where the antenna was mounted.

All in all, it was a medium job, and we're mostly pleased with the results outside of very slow uploads in rural areas. Short of satellite I am not sure we could do much better. By the way, Mobile MustHave has fabulous support and I recommend them for buying a modem/plan bundle, and navigating the torrents of information.

 

[Submariner]

For others thinking about installing this setup or similar themselves, but who have a longer cable run than 2meters from the antenna to the router.

How much does a longer antenna cable extension affect performance?

Signal strength is measured in decibels, which is based on a logarithmic scale. It's signal loss varies also based on the frequency of the signal. LTE covers a wide range of frequencies. The higher the frequency the greater the loss caused by longer cables.

If you need to stretch the antenna cables, you want to go with the highest quality cable you can find and you want it to be as short as necessary. 1meter, 3meter, 5meter... The cable is also not that flexible and doesn't bend easily (nor should it be bent very much).

It's a trade-off between getting that antenna up high on the mast and keeping that antenna length as short as possible. It's better to run longer power cables to the router and place the router closer to the antenna if possible. The longer that antenna cable goes, the less power available to transmit.

Here's some specifics examples. The Peplink Mobility 42G comes with a 2meter cable.
The below examples are for 2meter cable.
Or 2meter + 3 meter = 5 meters.
Or 2meter + 5 meter. = 7 meters.

Frequencies used in cellular and WIFI are:
600-960mhz, 1427-1517mhz, 1710-2170mhz, 2300-2700mhz, 5000-6000mhz.

POYNTING EXTENSION CABLE FOR 7 IN 1 ANTENNAS, uses LMR-195 cable.
600mhz (T-Mobile's Band71) at 2meters = 0.6dB loss. Cable run efficiency: 88%.
600mhz (T-Mobile's Band71) at 5meters = 1.6dB loss. Cable run efficiency: 72%.
600mhz (T-Mobile's Band71) at 7meters = 2.3dB loss. Cable run efficiency: 62%.

2500mhz (4g/LTE Urban band) at 2 meters = 1.6dB loss. Cable run efficiency: 74%
2500mhz (4g/LTE Urban band) at 5 meters = 3.4dB loss. Cable run efficiency: 50%
2500mhz (4g/LTE Urban band) at 7 meters = 4.9dB loss. Cable run efficiency: 36%

When looking at the dB loss, keep in mind transmit power is 21dbm at the LTE router.

Here's an online calculator that does the math.
https://www.timesmicrowave.com/Calculator?Product=LMR-195&RunLength=16&Frequency=2500