serpa4":3itvapa9 said:
It is unfortunate that we cannot have better quality control on things that cost more than a house. If we find these things in a house (not that much!) we can have it fixed and not kill us. Things on a boat can kill us.
It's unfortunate that everyone says it normal when we should not expect it to be normal. To accept defects and poor quality as normal is just ashamed. Wrong in every possible way.
A good quality check by FM or the dealer should eliminate 99% of issues, BEFORE ANY CUSTOMER see it. I'd also say that it really should be FM and not a dealer doing the work. The dealer just accepted a poorly assembled, no-QC boat. They should not have to accept it in the 1st place.
Unfortunately it is also in the RV industry.
Imagine buying a 350,000 car and having all those issues! It would not be accepted by ANY person.
What changed in the car world? Imports.
When we have viable options being shipped in from Europe, South Africa, etc. and sales go down, things will change. The US car industry found out too late and imports flew into the US. The US auto industry said, you have not choice but to buy our Piece of S. cars. Times changed.
I do love my C30, but fit and finish could be much better. There were no other boats that met my needs over FM C30. I'd definitely buy my boat again. However, if there were more/other choices, maybe I wouldn't.
It really is a sign of literally not caring. An assembler 99% of the time knows he did something wrong. He knows he didn't put a 2nd hose clamp, he knows he left hole saw circles laying in the bilge, he knows the vinyl has bubbles when he installed it. They know when the screwed the panel in place that the screw was stripped, they know this stuff absolutely. They simply don't care and the factories do nothing about it. Because the consumer has no choice.
I wanted a trailerable boat, 10' not 10'3". I wanted large fuel tanks, large holding/fresh water, want relatively good MPG, want diesel, want 2 beds, want decent top speed, etc. No other boat fit this. Beneteau Swift trawler would have been sweet, but too wide. This other boat would have been great, but 79 gallons diesel, this boat had 30 gallons black, etc. C30 was the only boat to fit my needs.
Great boat, but room for improvements. I have not regrets on my purchase at all as it fits all my needs/wants. Plan to use the crap out of my boat!
P.S. customer service is a big plus. FM delivers great Customer Service. Thanks to them for that. They always call me back, help order parts, etc. friendly people and it helps. Customer service is lacking so much these days.
I found this post somewhat interesting, not so much because of the expectation around FM but around the world somewhat broadly. I wish I had the kind of experience that could lead to the expectations implied by this post, but frankly life has taught me the exact opposite.
A $350k car without problems?! Ask a Ferrari or Lambo mechanic. I know one (plus a guy who owns a dealership). 20%+ of the cars are in the shop within three months. Or ask an experienced Ferrari owner. I know a few. None of them expect the cars to be without issues when new, which is why a lot of experienced owners (not the ones buying just for flash) prefer to buy modestly used.
How about houses? This is why I won't buy new construction. Even extremely reputable, experienced builders of high-end homes don't build defect-free new houses. The nicer the house, the higher end the construction, the more complex the build and the more likely there will be issues! My first house was in a brand new development of 30 houses, by a builder well known for their construction quality, and was about the same price as my tug. Half the houses needed some kind of repair in the first six months. That was better than average.
How about airplanes? Google "Boeing 787 charleston manufacturing trash" and see what I mean (although, I think Boeing's conduct is pretty inexcusable).
I don't typically buy expensive things new unless I am involved in or can supervise their construction (and even then, I'm wary!). Why not? Because new, expensive things usually means lots of initial problems that somebody else hasn't dealt with. Old -- a year or two old -- means that whatever kinks existed at time of manufacture have usually been worked out by the initial owner (a chump? who's to say) and I can focus on what is usually the better known quantity of wear and tear.
As BBMarine noted, the maritime industry isn't like the auto industry (despite claims). But the truth is, *no* other sellers of expensive consumer products are like the auto industry when it comes to consistency of manufacture and initial reliability. That's because the auto industry builds things on an assembly line, at speed, is heavily regulated, and doesn't have much room for error. The more bespoke an auto is (think my Ferrari example), the more likely it is to have the sort of build problems others have identified in their tugs. There are some exceptions, to be sure, but they aren't the general rule. And in the
luxury market, quality has come down not (as the post above claims) despite imports, but rather *because* of them. When Mercedes customers demand cheaper prices because of Kia, it is Mercedes quality that suffers. Corners get cut.
In the world of B2B sales and service, things can (but aren't necessarily) a bit different -- and prices can be higher. Some of this is simplicity. Commercial grade often means over-engineered, or engineered for dead-simple simplicity, at the expense of other things (like cost). I often buy commercial-grade products for this reason.
I'll close this quasi-rant / TED talk with a bit of a story from a few years back, still in my bachelor days. I was getting a drink in a marina bar and happened to be sitting near the crew of a brand-new superyacht sitting in the harbor. One of the crew members was about my age, and pretty cute, so I found a way to strike up a conversation with them (well, her). Turns out their almost brand-new, many-million-dollar superyacht from a well-known and reputable builder was stuck at anchor because of nearly catastrophic engine failure. Why? Well, someone at the builder had accidentally installed engine coolant line hose rated to nowhere near 180 degrees. The crew, experienced in superyacht delivery and as crew, had seen similar things happen many times before. The outlook I've espoused in this post helped get the girl :lol:
None of this is an excuse for shoddy workmanship (Boeing probably fits that category), but bespoke or small-volume construction of complex things is prone to error or issues in even the best-intentioned (or very expensive) circumstances, and unless you want to pay another 10%, I get it. What's important is that the manufacturer makes it right -- eventually. If that isn't a bargain you're interested in, buy lightly used with a good survey. You'll probably come out happier, and it will almost always be cheaper.
