R25 Inverter AC Lithium Option

[philbyrd]

Just pulled the trigger on a 2021 R25. Ordered the $5k Inverter AC Lithium Option that I was told is available for 2021 production. Can any provide more detail on the lithium option. As I understand from the dealer, AC battery and 2 house batteries are lithium and 8 plus hours running AC on hook. Nothing on Ranger site yet. Do the house batteries also run AC, max run time AC, etc. This ended my concern as to no genset, but would like to know what I am getting. Thanks


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[JudgeG]

I'm in the same boat (pun intended) except I've ordered a R-27 with the lithium a/c option. If there are any differences in the 25' and the 27' would you address that also, please?

 

[dmecimore]

Would be interested in hearing if it's possible to retro-fit a 2019 R23 with Inverter AC, possibly with Lithium batteries etc.

Or is the cost just astronomical?

 

[Andrew Custis]

Hello Phil,

Congrats on your purchase and thank you for your business. At the beginning of this year we will be making Lithium Ion Batteries an option for all outboard models. Basically, it will allow you to run the air conditioning on the inverter with a much higher capacity battery bank. We will be using (4) 150AH batteries for a total of 600 amp hours. With Lithium, you can utilize about 90% of your capacity whereas lead acid or AGM only allow about 50%. With that being said, figure your numbers in at around 540AH available. The Air conditioning unit will draw approximately 70 amps per hour so this means with a fully charged bank of batteries, you "should" be able to get around 7 hours without running the engine. Now, keep in mind, that would deplete all of your house bank and it will take some time to recharge that bank so try to be conservative.

These new batteries will also come with an app that allows you to monitor the batteries from your phone which is really cool. Just like an amp hour gauge with more features.

Very cool setup and I am excited for it to get started!

 

[Andrew Custis]

Doug,

Converting is certainly possible but you will need to make several changes to the charging system to allow it. I would wait until we finalize everything where we could provide a wiring diagram should anyone care to switch over.

Thank you,

 

[Brian 27 OB]

It sounds like you guys are going with the Victron Batteries. I am excited to see the charging design, we are going to switch in the spring. Same weight as the four 110ah AGM, 3x the usable AH and a lower Peukert exponent. Hopefully Victron releases a DC to DC 60amp charger soon to utilize the aux charging on the Yamaha a little better than the 30amp they have available now. Glad RT didn't go with batteries without external monitoring. Thinking that will be required in the future. Those drop in type LiFePO4 batteries might be a problem in the future.

I love that you guys are always evolving with the changing trends in the industry and listening to customers feedback.

 

[Andrew Custis]

Hey there Brian,

Were not using the Victron branded batteries but I have learned that many of the Lithium manufacturers are offering the same thing in regards to the monitoring side of things. We are using a DC to DC charger which will utilize better charging but more importantly, it will provide the correct charging voltage to the Lithium batteries.

Appreciate the feedback and look forward to doing some more testing on this soon!

 

[philbyrd]

Thanks Andrew. Excited to see it in action!


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[iggy]

Is that battery option worth it vs the price. Why not run the genset? The run time will be limited on batteries and the genset can run all day long and keep the batteries fully charged.

Keep in mind that that other things will be pulling power off the batteries. Lights, pumps, fridge, and more besides the a/c unit, lowering the run time.

 

[Brian 27 OB]

I don’t think the 23 or 25 have a gen set option. In my 27 I am putting something else where the generator would be mounted so lithium is my only option. I think the lithium batteries are a great substitute if you are only doing an overnight or two and mostly stay in slips between day boating. I’m in the Potomac River and Chesapeake Bay so it’s a different than PNW or Florida. My last couple boats had a gen sets and the noise got annoying so I would prefer not to have one. But everyone’s different. I also think what RT is charging for the upgrade is peanuts compared to trying to do it aftermarket. I’m spending a bunch more than they are charging.

 

[Red-27]

Is that battery option worth it vs the price. Why not run the genset?

The issue is that they cant add gas generators at the moment due to EPA standards. I ordered a r-27 last month with a generator and was recently notified of this. I am rather excited for the battery option but am hoping to add additional batteries as well for extended anchoring time. My current understanding is that the factory is still up in the air on what the exact specifications and setup of the system will be.

I am curious where they will be placing these batteries, as well as if they will be expanding the solar system. I would have no idea where you could put more solar panels though. I wonder if it would be reasonable to rig some ontop of the Bimini top or replace it all together with a solar top.

 

[philbyrd]

Yes. R-25 no generator option. Aftermarket install 10-15 k I am told. Plus gas only as no room for diesel tank, R-25 only has 100 gal tank. And need the storage for inflatable dinghy.


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[JudgeG]

Understanding the rare scenario of "the second day on the hook" and batteries therefore semi-expended, what's the smallest portable gas generator that'll charge the lithium batteries and the approximate time of charge. I think you can get a Honda 2200i with a 30 amp outlet. I think lots of folks have one on their 27 OB.

A-ipower makes a dual fuel (gas/lpg) 2000 watt generator, also with a 30 amp outlet. While you lose 10% power with propane, that'd be quite nice not to have stinky gas fumes while running the auxiliary generator to top off the batteries.

I doubt it, but has anyone run the a/c while charging the house batteries? Cake and eat it too.

 

[Eric R]

Hello Phil,

Congrats on your purchase and thank you for your business. At the beginning of this year we will be making Lithium Ion Batteries an option for all outboard models. Basically, it will allow you to run the air conditioning on the inverter with a much higher capacity battery bank. We will be using (4) 150AH batteries for a total of 600 amp hours. With Lithium, you can utilize about 90% of your capacity whereas lead acid or AGM only allow about 50%. With that being said, figure your numbers in at around 540AH available. The Air conditioning unit will draw approximately 70 amps per hour so this means with a fully charged bank of batteries, you "should" be able to get around 7 hours without running the engine. Now, keep in mind, that would deplete all of your house bank and it will take some time to recharge that bank so try to be conservative.

These new batteries will also come with an app that allows you to monitor the batteries from your phone which is really cool. Just like an amp hour gauge with more features.

Very cool setup and I am excited for it to get started!

This is a very exciting development! I assume the AC will be a "soft start" system, that reduces the initial power impact of compressor startup?

 

[dmecimore]

Is that battery option worth it vs the price. Why not run the genset? The run time will be limited on batteries and the genset can run all day long and keep the batteries fully charged.

Keep in mind that that other things will be pulling power off the batteries. Lights, pumps, fridge, and more besides the a/c unit, lowering the run time.

For me, what RT is describing with this new setup sounds perfect. We plan to be mostly in marinas at night but would love A/C when driving (it can get close to 100 degrees here in the summer).

We have a portable Yamaha generator but really it's a bit of a pain.

Going to look at this Lithium setup really closely once it's finalized to see if adding to my 2019 R23 is feasible.

So far seems like a really smart solution.

 

[Cutwater28GG]

Andrew, can you post the wiring schematic and components/manufacturers of the lithium setup you guys are going to install?

 

[Martin610]

Interesting concept. I had Yamaha outboards for many years until I got my C-28. The alternators didn't put out much power at idle. I wonder if they are using the stock alternator?

Also, the EPA angle on gensets is something I am not aware of? What has changed? Does it affect diesel gensets too?

-martin

 

[Andrew Custis]

I will definitely post the schematic once our electrical engineer finalizes everything. Stay tuned!

 

[philbyrd]

Update on this? Int rested to see exactly what my boat will have!

 

[CruisingElvinRay]

Understanding the rare scenario of "the second day on the hook" and batteries therefore semi-expended, what's the smallest portable gas generator that'll charge the lithium batteries and the approximate time of charge. I think you can get a Honda 2200i with a 30 amp outlet. I think lots of folks have one on their 27 OB.

A-ipower makes a dual fuel (gas/lpg) 2000 watt generator, also with a 30 amp outlet. While you lose 10% power with propane, that'd be quite nice not to have stinky gas fumes while running the auxiliary generator to top off the batteries.

I doubt it, but has anyone run the a/c while charging the house batteries? Cake and eat it too.

We have the Honda 2200 Companion generator with the 30amp plug. Yes, you can run the battery charger and A/C at the same time. You can monitor power with an app for the generator.

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