Replacing Seaward Hot Water Tank

griervictoria":2mys7fez said:
I have had a small amount of coolant leaking on my 2014 R31, for a few months. It has now been diagnosed by pressure testing as a leak in the hot water tank from the coolant which works the bus heater and heats the water from the engine.
The bad news is that to replace the 5 year old tank requires the stove to be removed as well as some cabinetry and a new unit fitted. The estimate for this is $2450 US, including parts and labor, which is staggering to me and so for the moment, I am going to check my coolant level every trip out of the boathouse and keep adding as required. It leaks about a cup every 4 or 5 hours.
I am surprised that after 5 years a hot water tank which in a boat is not used nearly as much as a domestic hot water tank should fail.
Has anyone else had this experience?
Click to expand...
From my post in this thread 12/18.
My curiosity got the better of me and I called Seaward. The company was sold to Attwood 3 years ago and the tanks are now being produced in MI. The person I spoke with stated the engine loop is a double lined loop, both loops would have to corrode for coolant to enter the the domestic water and the smell of engine coolant would be noticeable at the faucet. Average life of the units are 10 years.
Make sure it is not the hose clamps on the heater. Since I replaced my tank I have re- tightened the clamps twice due to a seepage leak.
 
Thank you for your post today, Brian. I checked the clamps which are tight and no sign of any coolant leakage under them. There is a stain from leakage at the back of the tank which runs into the engine compartment and no there is no coolant in the fresh water. I have had the hoses to the coolant turned off for the last 3 hours of engine use and there is no leakage, so of course no bus heater or engine heated hot water. Originally I believed it to be a leak in the engine due to the pool of fluid collecting on the starboard side of the Volvo.
I am going to run out to lunch on Thursday for about a 3 hour round trip to SaltSpring Island here in BC with the hoses open so will get a chance again to see where the fluid is coming from.
Thank you for your help
 
Same issues on my Cutwater 30 with Seaward hot water heater. Hoses appear tight but there seems to be a small (2 tablespoons) puddle of coolant at the rear of the tank. Don't know whether to bypass the heater with the coolant hoses or install a new one; I'd like to keep the cabin heater functionality. Access is really tight. Any more insight from anyone?
 
New 2012 R27 owner here and I'm confused by some of this discussion. How are "engine feed hoses" related to the hot water? On my Tug, I have a switch on the AC panel labeled "Water Heater". I turn it on and the water gets hot. I thought the hot water was all run by electric like a coil in the tank? I also don't understand why coolant of any kind would be in the hot water heater. Can someone explain all the inputs and outputs to the Water tank and how the Seaward works? Thanks, GF.
 
Since you have an inboard engine Ranger Tug, you have two ways to generate hot water.
First is the way you mentioned - using shore power or a generator to run electricity to the heating coils in the hot water tank. There is a switch at the A/C panel to turn this on and off.
The second way to get hot water is through engine heat. Hot coolant from engine is pumped through a hose into tubes running inside the hot water heater. The coolant is then returned from the tubes through a hose back into the main engine coolant area. After running the engine for a while you will have hot water. This system is automatic with the engine running - there is no off/on switch.
For those of us with inboards that like to spend time away from the marina, the second method using hot engine coolant keeps us with loads of hot water! My hot water will last 2 days or more after running the engine for just an hour or two.
Sorry outboard guys, you don’t have the ability to get hot water just by running your outboards.
 
I have a 2012 25sc and had the same issue. Thought it was the tank too as the pink colour from the antifreeze dripped from the tank housing. One hose comes from the engine compartment and the other from the bus heater. By cutting the one hose to the bus heater where you can get at it by the sump drain, which you can reconnect with a bronze coupling and SS clamps later, pull the mounting screws in the cockpit compartment I was able to slide the tank out. No screws in the other end. It turned out to be a loose hose connection and the tank was perfect. Had me fooled until I pressure tested it. Almost bought a tank. Bought a cooling system pressure tester instead from Lordco. Mityvac MV 4560. Well worth it. Let’s you test and look at the entire system and each connection at full operating pressure with everything cold and quiet.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Thanks scross, I had no idea the hot water worked like that. It would be nice if details like that were explained in the Ranger Manual. But then, there's Tugnuts. GF
 
GaylesFaerie,
I simplified that coolant flow description for the R25 Classic. In my boat there’s a cabin heater and a Johnson pump involved in the entire system. In your R27 Classic it’s a simpler system - no Johnson pump.
The description of the “Closed Engine Cooling System” for your boat is detailed on page 19 of your Owners Manual.
After 5 years I keep finding new things about my R25 Classic. This fall I learned more about the guts of the Lewmar windlass, the DC only refrigerator and the aft bilge pump.
Funny how when everything is working fine you don’t seem to need all the system details!
 
GF: WARNING! When the engine is operating at 180 +/- degrees, the coolant loop is heating the domestic hot water to that temperature as well. Hot water at the sinks will be above the scalding level. Some owners have installed mixing or "tempering" valves to prevent this.
 
There is a pic of the disassembled HW heater and a mixing valve installed in my photo album. The mixing valve was a great modification to prevent HW scalding, especially if you have kids onboard.
 
Brian,
I am interested in adding a mixing valve on our HW heater but it looked like a formidable task. How hard was it to install?
Did you have to route hoses all over the place to get it plumbed correctly?
The front of our HW heater is easy to access but not the back.

PS: One of the benefits of having water in the HW tank over 140 degrees is that water at that temp kills Legionella bacteria and many other nasty bugs. We change out our fresh water quite often but it’s harder to change out water in the HW tank.
 
scross":2q3vfvzw said:
Brian,
I am interested in adding a mixing valve on our HW heater but it looked like a formidable task. How hard was it to install?
Did you have to route hoses all over the place to get it plumbed correctly?
The front of our HW heater is easy to access but not the back.

PS: One of the benefits of having water in the HW tank over 140 degrees is that water at that temp kills Legionella bacteria and many other nasty bugs. We change out our fresh water quite often but it’s harder to change out water in the HW tank.
Click to expand...
Here’s the post I made a few years ago on the install.
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=7574&hilit=+Mixing+valve
 
Thanks Brian!
Another project added to my over winter maintenance & upgrade list!
 
I was confronted with the same problem, leaking engine coolant around the HW tank. I was quoted $3000 to replace the tank and the high cost was due to the fact that cabinetry has to be removed in order to lift out the old (6 years is not old IMHO) tank and replace it. I decided to just turn off the coolant taps to the tank and get hot water electrically through shore power when needed. Did nothing for many months and then Steve Phillips of Canoe Cove Mfg took a look. He replaced several hose clamps with better quality ones than the factory installed ones, tightened up others and 'voila' the problem was fixed for a fraction of the cost. Moral of the story get a second opinion if you are not happy with the first.
ps in six years of ownership of my R31, I have had many factory parts replaced as the need arose. In almost every case the factory parts were not the best available.
 
captstu":3l1lzpi9 said:
I replaced the shower sump with a small in-line pump on my R 25. It works much better than the original showers sump and give me easy access to the hot water tank.
Click to expand...

Hi captstu, can you provide details on the pump and installation of that in-line shower pump? Seems like a simpler drain method than the whole sump box with problematic bilge pump in it. Thanks, GF
 
So my water heater finally went. 11 years old, cracked hot water fitting on the tank, winterizing fluid leaking from the cold water inlet, both front corners rusted thru and also leaking fluid. I've had a link to this thread saved and was dreading trying to get the unit out. Turns out it was WAY easier and less messy than I feared. Of note:

Drained the hot water tank of all fluid first thing.

Getting to the engine coolant hoses off the back is uncomfortable for sure going thru the head sink floor, but with a small socket wrench loosening the hose clamps was under-whelming.

Before pulling off the engine hoses I drained coolant from the upper petcock on the intercooler (I think that is what it is called) of the Yanmar (I empty half way and refill in the spring anyway). That drained almost everything out of the lines leading to the helm heater. Then I connected the hoses with a nylon coupler until ready to install the new water heater.

After removing the AC wiring and fresh water hoses (did the coupler connector thing there too) on the front, I quick-dis-connected the water pump filter and pushed it forward, removed the inlet hose to the pump (towel underneath to collect fluid), removed the four mounting screws for the pump, and was able to stow the pump just outside the locker behind the hatch as there was plenty of wire. As many have reported on TugNuts, the wiring work was incomplete - one side of the but connector on one wire was heat shrunk and the other not while the other wire had neither side heat shrunk with gray corrosion starting inside. I'll re-wire that properly as its easy and accessible.

Removed the two screws on the tab holding the tank and slid it aft past where the pump was and just past the battery charger. Try as we may, my friend and I couldn't get it out. The constraining dimensions are the front and back faces which measure a square 13" x 13". We measured a bunch and thought if we could tilt the unit towards starboard (lift the port side) it might get out. However, tilting to starboard meant we needed more room on starboard, so we removed the 4 mounting screws for the charger and it too had enough wire to just fold it back to stern. With the pump and charger out of the way it allowed room to tilt the heater to starboard and lift out. The unit came out whole and not mods needed to the boat.

The boat is a 2012 R27. A picture of the empty locker is below. Its a bit distorted but it worked:
https://share.icloud.com/photos/025Sj457WEsZDwlX-tHcX3_EQ

Hope others don't feel too intimidated to taking theirs out when the time comes.
 
Brian B, since I'm replacing the water heater I decided to add a mixing valve like you did. The one thing I can't tell from your description of the process is the hose plumbing. Hot is easy, tank output goes into the valve and valve output goes forward to sinks. Where does the cold water source into the mixer come from? Did you just add a T to the water hose downstream of the pump that runs forward to the sinks? There is already one there to feed cold into the hot water tank. Or did you put a T on that feeder hose? Any help is appreciated. Gary
 
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