Stiff Steering

[Portugeezer]

On my '08 R-21EC I am finding that the steering gets very stiff after it sits, even for a couple of weeks. After a few days cruising, it gets easier to steer again. I am wondering if anyone has done maintenance on the Ultraflex cables and can enlighten me on what I should do. It seems rather soon to me, for a boat that is stored on the dry, to have issues with the cable already. Thanks, John.

 

[Blue Healer]

John, on my 2009 R21-EC I regularly spray the shafts that drive the tiller head with a lanolin product available here in Australia. With some difficulty, you can access the shafts through a small hatch under the stern seat. No problems so far. Cheers Graham

 

[Portugeezer]

I have removed the arm connecting the cable end to the steering shaft and note that the cable moves freely. The rudder, however, is too stiff to move by hand. I guess my next step is to start removing the large nuts holding the shaft in place. I suspect that the assembly is just too tight. No amount of lubricant has made any difference. Now to find a deep socket in that large size. Hmmm. . .

 

[Portugeezer]

Supplementary entry: Got the packing nut off but rudder still frozen. I can move it if I push firmly on it with my foot while lying on my back on the driveway. So it isn't exactly seized, but extremely stiff. I thought perhaps the rudder was jammed upward by pressure from the stainless skeg below, but that flexes away nicely from the bottom shaft. At this point, I don't know what could be causing the problem except corrosion on the shaft, but it is stainless and the housing inside the boat is a brass unit. Corrosion seems unlikely.

My next idea, and it seems to be a drastic one, is to remove the skeg and try to remove the rudder by hammering the top of the shaft in a downward direction. Foolish?

 

[ac holmes]

My 21 also has very stiff steering and I was also tempted to mess with the rudder post nut assembly, but realized that it is most likely a "stuffing box" set up like the prop shaft. I need some good advice about loosening the nut a little.

Best,

Andrew Holmes

 

[RProffer]

Before doing anything dramatic, I would first recommend contacting Andrew Custis at the factory.

 

[Portugeezer]

Andrew, as I mentioned above, the packing nut came off OK but it did not resolved the issue. I suspect that the inside of the rudder collar is filled with the same packing material as on the nut, which has now expanded to the point that it is interfering with the steering. The next task will be to remove the packing collar and have it reamed out to the proper tolerances. (In the movies, this is where the factory guy jumps in and tells us whether we are on the right track). Sorry that you too are having the same problem, but at least we each know we are not alone!

John

 

[captain's cat]

Before you start "reaming" anything, you should call the factory. Their numbers and Andrew's are all over the site.

Charlie

 

[Andrew Custis]

This is the first I have ever heard of this happening. I have seen where the cables are stiff due to routing or something like that. I will have to ponder this with the guys around the shop and see if we can come up with any ideas. Will respond soon.

 

[Portugeezer]

This morning I applied a bit of heat with a heat gun to the bronze rudder collar and it temporarily eased the restriction somewhat. This only proves that the issue is indeed in the collar.

 

[ac holmes]

Never underestimate the power of prayer...

I was doing a little housework on my new EC-21 today (it's been too hot to do much fishing or boating for a week or two)
and thinking of this recent discussion about "stiff steering" caused me to test the wheel a little to get the feel once again of how stiff it actually was. I was very pleased to discover a minor "healing" of sorts and the although the wheel is still too stiff, it is now manageable. I was especially concerned that the "stiffness" would soon wear my RayMarine x-5 auto pilot into ruin before it's time. I did not do a thing, except let the little boat bake in the sun for a week or so. Go figure...

Cheers,

Andrew Holmes

 

[Portugeezer]

After talking to the factory on this issue, I spoke with the rudder collar supplier. Don at Marine Hardware was unconvinced that it could be their product that was faulty as he had never heard of such a thing. I too was unconvinced because the unit had worked faultlessly until recently. But there I was with a seized rudder.

I ordered a new part from Marine Hardware and installed it today. The old part required 15 minutes of hammering to get it off the shaft. It fought stubbornly until the end. The new part fits nicely and turns effortlessly. There was no corrosion on the shaft or rudder collar. I have no explanation for why this happened except that crap like this happens to me more often than the average person. I could easily develop a persecution complex.

At the next opportunity, I am going to reinstall the components. I'll be sure to post any further developments but at this time things are looking good. John

 

[captain's cat]

Don, I'd send it back to them. Bet they find it was somewhat undersized or mis-shaped in some way.

Or mount it on a mahogany plaque with a nameplate of some sort and hang it on the wall! :?

Charlie

 

[Portugeezer]

Returned from a weekend cruise where I tested out the new steering. So that's what it is supposed to feel like! Mine had always been stiff and in fact I strained the wooden dash so much that the screw coming through the cabin from the outside (and near the fuel guage) had worked itself loose. Steering is now effortless and luckily there are no leaks that I can see. I have sent the old part to Marine Hardware and hope to hear from them on this issue.

On another note, I encountered Karma and it's 9-boat armada on the way through Pender Canal as they cruised northbound. The sight was awesome as the fleet made it's way up Bedwell Harbour. I feel pretty good about belonging to such a friendly boating community.

 

[RProffer]

I am glad you are fixed and back on the water. Thanks for keeping us posted on your progress and final solution.

 

[captainmike]

On my last ride in florida after logging 150 hours on my Ranger M21 the rudder bound up I was with a friend of mine a professional marine surveyor with 40 years experience.

This was a new one on both of us of course we had both seen cables freeze and steering heads go bad and could understand if through lack of use the rudder got stiff but the simplicity of the rudder post going through a bronze tube leaves little to fail.

luckily I had a 5lb hand sledge with me I almost put it back in the truck that morning as the rudder was all the way to port when the steering went up the St. Johns river near Sanford Florida.

I used the sledge to get the rudder back to center after removing the pin that attaches the cable to the steering arm and steered the boat with a paddle as my friend worked the throttle.

The boat is now back in Massachusetts and hopefully the cable is bad not the steering head but what ever it is I got maximum use out of AURA from December 17 to March 1.

When I get the time I will take apart the steering system remove the skeg and rudder then replace the broken parts and rudder packing making sure to use the correct grease.

I can not see having to replace the bronze tube but will hone it out if need be.

Capt. Mike

 

[Portugeezer]

Captain Mike,

This problem of yours sounds suspiciously like the event I encountered, in that you removed the steering cable but the rudder was still stiff. I tried to explain the steps for replacing mine with narrative and photos on my web site. If that helps, great. I never did hear back from Marine Hardware, although I sent them the old part (and paid for the shipping too!).

Por2geezer

 

[captainmike]

I finally got the rudder out yesterday after an afternoon of beating it with a sledge hammer heating it with a torch using hydraulic jacks and then finally unbolting it and using pullers then bending a puller and bending and cracking the flange on the bronze rudder tube.

My friends a marine surveyor and a marine mechanic who does a lot of running gear work kept saying the rudder post must be bent or some other mechanical answer.

The rudder was bound up so much it destroyed the steering system which was easy to replace compared to the rudder job.

The rudder bound up on my last ride after spending over two months and 150 hours of constant use.

The reason for all these problems SUPER CRUD after I got it apart and ran the tube over the post chipping off the stuff the post was free with no binding at all.

I am taking the whole setup to my friends shop to be checked out and being lucky as usual I had bought a new tube for $20 off a friend which I am sure is $200 at the prop shop.