Water in fuel separator

[HappyPlace]

Over the holiday weekend my Garmin and Volvo display notified me that we had water in the fuel. (2014 R31 with Volvo D4) I immediately shut the engine down. Closed off the fuel petcock at the tank. Removed the first inline filter/separator drain plug (what a task!) and found water in the bowl. Emptied same until only pink diesel came out. Closed drain plug. Tried to check the secondary drain on the bottom of the filter/separator where the sensor is located, but was unable to remove the plug after unplugging the wire. (Made a few calls and it was determined that the sensor is probably stripped on the filter.) So, the entire filter was removed. The fuel was examined and no visible water found. Same was reinstalled and primed. I also checked the filter/separator on the generator side and did not see any visible water present. I turned the Volvo and Garmin systems back on and no further warnings were issued. The engine was restarted. The generator was also started. I only ran everything for about 5-10 minutes to check for leaks and ensure everything ran fine. By the time the entire fiasco ended, it was too late to head out, so we remained at port.

As a side note, we had topped off our fuel (about 50 gallons) about two weeks ago and have run the boat for about 5-10 hours since then with no issues. I have been trying to utilize fuel from places that dispense a lot of diesel, so we would get fresh fuel.

My questions are:
1. Should I replace all the water separator filters onboard or just the first one in line that was exposed to the water?
2. Does anyone know if these filters are available online or at the factory? Even if they don't get replaced now, I would want spares onboard!
3. Was this filter/separator just doing its job and once cleaned and cleared, safe to operate the boat?
4. Can anyone think of anything that I missed or should be doing differently?
5. Does anyone know if Volvo recommends any type of fuel treatment additive?

I appreciate any and all input, as I do not want to damage my engine. The only crew member that was really upset was Roscoe, as he really missed running, swimming and retrieving sticks in the bay!

Hope everyone had a wonderful, safe Independence Day weekend!

Al Sr.

 

[Brian B]

I have a Yanmar so I can't speak directly to the Volvo.
I use this product to treat every gallon I put in the boat, its the only product recommended by Yanmar from my understanding, http://fppf.com/products-by-name?task=c ... duct&id=16 It can be purchased on Amazon.
You may still have water in the tank so I would be checking the water separator frequenly. With water in the fuel you could now develop a fungicide in the fuel that could clog filters. If it was me I would be speaking with a Volvo certified tech to find out what Volvo recommends for a fuel conditioner.
You could also have the fuel "polished", a process that removes contamination if it continues.
Always carry spare filters on the boat.

 

[NorthernFocus]

Water in diesel fuel is a fact of life. That's why the fuel system is designed to separate water and notify you when the primary filter(i.e.first one in the line) has been violated. Even if you purchase your fuel from a water free source, you will eventually get water from condensation in the fuel tank. The more humid location and/or the greater the day/night temperature change is, the more water you will have to contend with. Unfortunately along with the water comes biological growth(algae and bacteria) which must also be managed. To best manage fuel quality:

1) Buy your fuel from a reliable source. Easier said than done. How much fuel they sell doesn't necessarily mean anything.

2) Keep your fuel tanks full. This reduces the airspace in the tanks and therefore reduces the potential for condensation.

3) Use fuel additives. The one mentioned in the prior post is a good one that is intended to dissipate free water. In addition a product called Biobore will kill biological growth.

4) Routinely check the bowls on your filters for water and change the filters as recommended or more frequently as needed. Water in the bowl of the primary isn't necessarily a bad thing depending on how many hours of operation it represents. The filter is designed to knock the water out so water in the bowl means it is doing its job. Water in the secondary filter isn't good. If you ever find free water in the secondary you either have a lot of water in your system and/or the primary filter is inadequate.

If you think you have a problem get on top of it quickly. It gets worse with time, particularly the biological growth. Once it starts it grows exponentially. As mentioned there are fuel "polishing" systems available which can clean up the system once contaminated.

The absolute best defense is running the boat frequently, preferably on the water so that the tanks get stirred up a bit by the motion of the boat. The installed filters and the relatively high flow rate of common rail fuel systems function as a natural polishing system.

Hope this helps.

 

[NorthernFocus]

It occurred to me that neither of us thus far responded directly to your questions.

My questions are:
1. Should I replace all the water separator filters onboard or just the first one in line that was exposed to the water?
2. Does anyone know if these filters are available online or at the factory? Even if they don't get replaced now, I would want spares onboard!
3. Was this filter/separator just doing its job and once cleaned and cleared, safe to operate the boat?
4. Can anyone think of anything that I missed or should be doing differently?
5. Does anyone know if Volvo recommends any type of fuel treatment additive?

1) The filter "being exposed" to water doesn't necessarily mean it should be replaced. If you are using good quality (OEM or Racor) filter elements they only need be replaced based on hours usage and/or pressure drop (if you have such indication).

2) Another Volvo owner will have to respond. But if you have the filter manufacturer and part number I'd be surprised if you can't find them online. And most definitely yes, carry spares on board. At least one each of primary and secondary. Better yet two or three primaries and one secondary.

3) yes

4) see prior post

5) Another Volvo owner will have to respond.

 

[S. Todd]

The filters are available from the factory. That is were I purchase mine for the Volvo D-3-150.
I use Valvtect BioGuard Plus 6 with every fuel fill. I purchase it from West Marine but there are plenty of other sources.

Christy, a labradoodle that thinks she owns our boat, would like to advise Roscoe that having people do these chores for you and sometimes having to miss a swim, is a small price to pay for not having to skin one's knuckles and getting grease and diesel smell on our beautiful fur coats.

 

[TBates]

Hello Al,

I've taken a minute to attempt to answer a few of your questions:

1. Should I replace all the water separator filters onboard or just the first one in line that was exposed to the water?
-I wouldn't advise replacing either filter until you reach the recommended service interval's. As one of the replies stated below, it's perfectly normal for the pre-filter (water separator), to have some water in the bowl from time to time. Condensation and/or poor fuel quality when fueling are the two main causes of this. The alarm you received is sent from the engine mounted 'primary' filter, which lets you know that your 'pre' filter's bowl is full of water, and no longer able to separate the water from the fuel.

2. Does anyone know if these filters are available online or at the factory? Even if they don't get replaced now, I would want spares onboard!
-We stock many of the maintenance items for the different engine models. If you call the Kent facility, Richard our parts manager is able to put together a good spares kit to keep onboard.

3. Was this filter/separator just doing its job and once cleaned and cleared, safe to operate the boat?
-Yes to both.

4. Can anyone think of anything that I missed or should be doing differently?
-I would recommend preemptively draining the pre-filter bowl every couple months to avoid any future issues or downtime. The timeframe may need to be adjusted, the more you do it the more you'll know when it most likely will need done again.
-Concerning the 'stripped' water in fuel sensor, I personally haven't had seen one stripped sensor, although what I have seen is the green paint used to paint the engine can sometimes add some difficulty removing parts.

5. Does anyone know if Volvo recommends any type of fuel treatment additive?
-I haven't seen any specifically recommended fuel additives from Volvo, although one that Ranger/Cutwater has used in the past is called 'Stanadyne', which is a diesel fuel additive. This would be my best recommendation.

I hope this info helps, please feel free to contact me directly with any further questions.

Thank you,

Tim Bates
Volvo & Yamaha Engine Technician
Cutwater & Ranger Tug service
timbates@rangertugs.com

 

[HappyPlace]

Let me first thank everyone who posted a reply to this issue. I was very frazzled to say the least when that alarm went off indicating we had water in the fuel line. I envisioned a nightmare! We have never had a diesel engine on any of our boats and never had an issue with water in the fuel. I appreciate the detailed explanations provided to rectify the problem and maintain our system, more than you could know. I am a stickler for preventative maintenance, knowing this provides the best chance for problem free, long lasting equipment life. We had previously owned a sign and printing business and my fellow franchisees could never figure out why our equipment lasted so long, without the issues many of them incurred. I attributed this to the preventative maintenance on the machinery and the cleanliness of the shop.

Anyway, enough babbling! Thank you all again!

Al Sr.

 

[BB marine]

Has any one used PRI-D fuel conditioner ? My Cutwater is my first Diesel . I've always used seafoam in my gas engines for a stabilizer and fuel system cleaner . I looked at several different all claiming to do the same thing . The Pri-3 was used mostly in commercial applications , hospitals , municipalities , trucking companies diesel storage tanks . It had great reviews . I'm looking for a additive for storage and a conditioner for use that actually works . My father had a 29 Rough Water back in the 80's 80 hp Leman , it was very fuel efficient 160 gal fuel capacity . The fuel tanks were always getting plugged up with algae . It took some time to get rid of it and keep it from happening again . We had to drain both tanks and solvent wash them to completely to resolve the issue . I use a lot more fuel with the Cutwater then he did but I still don't want to take any chances .

 

[dclagett]

Looking for advice from seasoned diesel operators.

Well it finally happened to me, I drained my primary fuel filter and found about 1 oz of water along with some white/gray slime. I also drained the secondary fuel filter on the engine and did not find any water or contaminates. I pulled the primary filter element and did not find any slime or debris on the element, however the color of the filter element was light brown (I think the filter element has gotten somewhat darker since I changed it about 60 hours ago). The slime I assume is some sort of microbe and I plan to treat the tank with a biocide.

My question is with such a small amount of water/microbe debris should I have the fuel tank cleaned or just let the filters do their job. I plan to drain the primary fuel filter after each use of the boat for a couple weeks to try and determine the magnitude of the problem.

Any comments or advice?

 

[BB marine]

I'm not a fan of using the engine to clean the tank. First issue is the fuel pickup is 1 " off the bottom of the tank. most of the water and sediment lays on the bottom of the tank. The installed fuel tank pick up tube has a screen on it that may get fouled depending on how much water and slime and debris is in the tank. There are 5 fuel ports on the fuel tank. I would remove the fitting at the top of the tank , make up tubing with a fitting and attach it to a oil pump extractor. Slide the tubing down to the bottom of the tank and pump the fuel out into a open 5 gallon pail to inspect water and debris. Filter the bad stuff out and put the good stuff back in the tank. Doing this will pull out the water and debris and insure you got all the bad stuff out. Cheaper then changing filters and much more effective. You will know for sure your tank is clean.

Picture of pick up tube with screen. I removed the screen to prevent it plugging in the future.


The picture shows a fitting I installed to remove any debris from the bottom of the tank. I stainless steel tubing to get to the bottom of the tank. The tubing is also used to suck oil out of oil pan of the engine.


I installed a fuel polishing system and aux fuel tank last winter to help prevent this problem. The pick up goes right to the bottom of the tank and runs thru a 2 micron filter transferring the fuel to a 20 gallon tank and then runs back to the main tank . Its over kill but it works great. I have pictures in my album.

There are many articles about additives do research.

 

[NorthernFocus]

...My question is with such a small amount of water/microbe debris should I have the fuel tank cleaned or just let the filters do their job. I plan to drain the primary fuel filter after each use of the boat for a couple weeks to try and determine the magnitude of the problem.

Any comments or advice?

Well, it depends. How old is the boat and what is the history? Has it been used regularly or been sitting idle for some time? Have fuel additives been used regularly or not? When is the last time the bowl on the primary filter was checked for water?

Like Brian I'm not a fan of using the engine to clean out a fuel tank. But finding a bit of water and grunge in the filter bowl doesn't necessarily mean there's a problem in the tank. Or there could be a huge issue. It depends...

 

[TBates]

Hello dclagett,

A little bit of discoloration on the primary fuel filter is completely normal. It sounds to me that the filter is doing exactly what it's intended for.

As advised by others, before polishing the tank I would recommend inspecting the inside of the tank first. The easiest way to do this would be to remove the fuel sender which is secured by 5 or 6 small hex head screws (5/16" I believe). This will give you a decent size inspection port to see if you can spot any evidence of growth/water in the tank. You might try a cheap inspection camera like the one I've posted a link to below:

https://www.lightinthebox.com/en/p/...ping&msclkid=9ca31ab629691bca0c7641f32ed4c2e2

I like to mark the orientation of the fuel sender/gasket on the tank to ensure it goes back in the same way. Also be sure to fully tighten down the screws when reinstalling the sender, and check for leaks with the tank full while the boat is underway.

Thank you,

-Tim

 

[dclagett]

Brian, Dan & Tim,

Thanks for the advice. I now plan to take my oil extractor, after cleaning, and remove liquid from the bottom of the tank until only pure diesel is present. Hopefully I don't find a lot of water or grunge. I also have a camera and will look at the tank walls. If I do find significant water or grunge on the walls I will go ahead and get the tank cleaned.

The boat has been used weekly, however I did not check the fuel filter prior to putting it in service this year. I did changed the filter near the end of the season last year and there was no water or grunge in the old filters. Also the fuel tank was topped off prior to winter storage at a reliable marina and the boat was shrink wrapped all winter. We did have significant rains this spring and I wonder if somehow rain came in thru the fuel vent.

Thanks again... Dick

 

[dclagett]

Went to remove fuel sender unit today and found that it is installed with machine screws not self taping. This implies there are nuts or a metal backing ring with tapped holes. Before I continue could someone let me know the attachment configuration. The screw I removed was quite short so I didn't know if needed to get some longer screws in order to insert finger to hold attachment hardware up while I remove the unit or is the hardware attached somehow to the tank.

I don't want to go fishing in the tank for attachment hardware.

Thanks

 

[BB marine]

There are inserts molded in the tank. The nuts will not fall off. I would recommend marking the orientation of the sender as mentioned before. If you remove the sender I highly recommend a new gasket and if the screws have a rubber seal at the head of the screw inspect the seal and if marginal I would consider replacing them too.I like using the tank fittings because they are easier to seal, a little pipe dope and your done. If you remove the sender it is a good time to properly calibrate your fuel sender so it is accurate. After I recalibrated the sending unit it is accurate to +/- 3 gallons . It was off +/- 15 gallons with factory calibration. The fuel gauge now reads very close to the Garmin reading. It is very accurate from a 1/2 tank to empty. Good Luck on your project.

 

[dclagett]

Brian, thanks I was hoping the attaching hardware was attached to the tank. I do have a tank fitting with a plug so that would be the easiest. I may just do that this time. Good suggestion on calibration of the sender, I may do that later.

Thanks again

 

[dclagett]

I pulled the plug in the rear center of the fuel tank and stiffened up a plastic tube attached to my oil extractor and pumped out some fuel from the bottom of the tank. I was expecting some water and grunge but just pure fuel was all I retrieved. I moved the tube around the bottom as best I could, but still no water or grunge. Either the tank is super clean or the tank front is lower than the tank rear when the boat is in the water and all the nasty stuff flows forward.

I think at this time I will continue to run the boat and monitor the primary fuel filter for water etc., before I have the boat pulled and positioned bow up and then pump the tank.

Any thoughts?