What's noticed when holding tank becomes full ?

[baz]

OK.... Here's my final solution 😱 to this issue for avoiding the holding tank overfilling.... and after discussing with Andrew it should be a good solution. After installing it I will post back here on how well it works and solves the issue.

I'm going to install the Fill-Rite TT10ANC In-Line Digital Turbine Meter, 1" Female NPT Thread, 1" ID, Nickel-Plated Aluminum (see Amazon https://www.amazon.com/Fill-Rite-TT10AN ... flow+meter.)

This device can be configured to display various measurements such as liters, ounces, pints, quarts and gallons with an accuracy of +– 1%. It does require 2x AA replaceable batteries.

So long as no one manually pours water into the bowl the flow meter will give me a precise number of gallons pushed in/out to the 30 gallon holding tank. 🙂

It costs $158.61 with free S&H and will work perfectly for me as I've had this confirmed by Andrew. I will order today and have it on my doorstep come July 12.

After installing I will post a review of how well it works for me to solve the issue for avoiding the new 2018 R-27's holding tank from over filling.

I really think this is best solution at this time.

 

[Todd]

The flow meter looks like a nice solution, I have several of these meters that I use for work related flow measuring. The problem is on my 29 I didn't have a place to install one that was easy to see. A meter with a remote reading head would have worked, such as a Blue White meter, but are considerly more expensive and would have been more trouble to install. I just went with the Tank Tender.

You would think someone could make a sensor that would work reliably through the plastic tanks on our boats.

 

[baz]

Darn Amazon.... by the time I decided to click buy the price for the Fill-Rite flow meter went from $158.61 to $221.16..... bugger... this is what happens when one delays and procrastinates... 😉

The Ranger Tugs (RT) Raritan SeaEra toilet is installed with the optional sea water strainer to keep out unwanted cruddy stuff sucked in through the hull grate. So this means the flow meter will need to be installed between the strainer and the toilet to protect the flow meter from having crud pass though it.

The flow meter will need to be visible and its 2x replaceable AA battery access will be required.

Hopefully, RT allows the Raritan SeaEra's optional sea water strainer to be user accessible as well as the strainer will need occasional cleaning.

Must remember to always either reset the flow meter's display and/or record its reading each time the holding tank is pumped out. I will also assume the holding tank can never be completely emptied when pumping out so will perform pump out after say a max of 25 to 27 gallons have been recorded by the flow meter.

IMO...This is going to be a useful addition for avoiding the holding tank from overflowing and creating a messy situation as well as avoiding breaking the US laws. 🙂

 

[baz]

The flow meter looks like a nice solution, I have several of these meters that I use for work related flow measuring. The problem is on my 29 I didn't have a place to install one that was easy to see. A meter with a remote reading head would have worked, such as a Blue White meter, but are considerly more expensive and would have been more trouble to install. I just went with the Tank Tender.

You would think someone could make a sensor that would work reliably through the plastic tanks on our boats.

I'm presuming placing a sensor inside the holding tank to capture liquid level is fraught with issues. This has to be the reason why RT does not provide any gauge like they do for the fresh water tank. For house sceptic tank arrangements when the main tank fills the gray water passes through a removable strainer and then goes into a pump out tank and in that tank there's a level sensor such that when liquid reaches a certain level a pump motor starts to pump out the gray water to the leach field. If on a boat such a system were to be employed the overflow tank could have a simple water sensor that triggers an alarm notifying the Captain the holding tank is full, and the head is no longer to be used.

I'm hopeful the Fill-Rite flow meter will be a useful addition for me for knowing when to pump out the holding tank. If it proves a reliable method then maybe RT can adopt it for future builds. RT should be able to procure the Fill-Rite flow sensors for a good price, plus it's an easy installation to do as the boat is put together in the factory. It will also give RT owners some peace of mind I would think. I simply cannot think of a worse situation to having the holding tank overflow inside the boat.

My assumption here is... what goes in has to go out, and the flow meter for measuring what goes in should be an excellent method for monitoring this.

 

[JamesTXSD]

On our boat and RV heads, there has always been more than "water" that goes into the holding tank. An issue with the holding tank monitors on boats is... um, slosh: stuff in the tank gets moved as the boat pitches or yaws.

Using the fresh water tank to determine how much you are putting into the waste holding tank is fine... as long as you don't wash your hands, wash dishes, shower, etc, etc. We have always sanitized the fresh water tank in our boats and RVs, and filter drinking water, but otherwise use it like you use your plumbing at home.

 

[baz]

When I plumbed fresh water to my DIY installed Tecmar ECO electric flush toilet on my R-25 (Classic) I ensured no back flow would occur using a one-way valve. The factory installs the Raritan SeaEra electric flush toilet in the new 2018 R-27 and it can be plumbed to use sea water or fresh water and has a built-in back flow valve to ensure there's no flow back into the fresh water system.

One of the interesting Raritan SeaEra statements made in its User Manual is "No special toilet paper is required". I assume this means the macerator will handle normal household TP, but still wonder about using that for the boat's holding tank's capability of breaking down the thicker paper pieces. I will be periodically using the Odorlos powder (Yara North America, Inc, the importer and seller of Odorlos, and for more info on Odorlos see - Jenna.engel@yara.com. Jenna Engel Sales Manager. Odorlos Industrial Industrial Nitrates Office: +1 813-222-3847 ) for the holding tank treatment. Of course the normal advice for the sanitary system is ... Avoid bleach, pine oil cleaners, Lysol and household chemical bowl cleaners...and do the regular preventive maintenance required to replace worn seals, gaskets and valves BEFORE they wear completely out and fail.

For us, we refuse to drink the boat's fresh water for many reasons previously mentioned and discussed a year or so back here in this forum. Each to there own... so to speak. We do however use the fresh water for shower, washing dishes with the hot water, but never for drinking or cooking. We carry/stow enough bottled water for our needs.

On our new R-27 I elected to have the cockpit Refrigerator mainly to hold extra water bottles and soft drinks and to keep them cool. This frees up the main cabin Refrigerator for food items that need refrigeration to avoid spoiling.

 

[walldog]

If the specs for this pump are known, and let's say it states 1 gallon per minute, then it should be relatively easy to keep track of how much water has been pumped.

If the button is held in for 30 secs then 1/2 gallon would be pumped. Thus after 60 such flushes the 30 gallon holding tank would be filled.

Going a step further a simple circuit board could be developed/made that would sense the amount of time the button had been held down and based on the pumps gallons/min number compute the gallons pumped and display this or simply use a LED level indicator display to reveal the level of the holding tank's contents.

Started not to even read this thread but I sure would have missed an interesting discussion. First of all Slackwater Jack wins the prize for best retort.

Barry, you have neglected to figure out how to measure output of bodily fluids. You could use a measuring cup for #1 but how do you measure #2?

In my motorhome with a similar size holding tank, 7 days we dump black tank. In our R27 and our R31 7 days again works for the two of us. If you are worried put it on a 4 or 5 day schedule and forget about it. Do not try expensive untried methods that detract from boating pleasure by keeping a log.....really? And in practice never pass up a chance to pump out especially after more than a couple of days use.

And do not forget to add at least 2-3 gallons of water after each pump out to allow the water to slosh around when you hit those 4 foot wind waves. That will loosen any stuck solids that tend to collect in the corners of the tank.

 

[walldog]

The deck gets really, really slippery?

😀

 

[502mad]

KISS principle is often best! [emoji106]

 

[baz]

Herb:

Hmmmm, still lurking here.... 🙂 Nice for you to poop (sorry, meant pop :lol: ) in here. Thanks. 🙂 ...Oh.. and how's your 14-foot-itis proceeding ?

• My head log was a jest at best.
  Yes, the human stuff added to the bowl (bodily fluids as you say) has to be taken care of and the Fill-Rite flow sensor will not capture that portion sent to the holding tank. That is why pump out will be done at or below the 25 gallon mark. That should deal with the "bodily fluids". :lol:
  Boating pleasure is increased/enhanced when there are no mishaps onboard.
  Having two known people onboard as you've mentioned makes the issue trivial .... but when there are more, the issue becomes more complex and one that needs some attention.
  Agree on taking the pump-out opportunity whenever possible.
  Yes, adding some fresh water back flow after a pump out has been my practice also. I also make sure I don't use the fuel dock's same fresh water hose to top up our fresh water tank. Horrors... 😱
  I'm certain my Fill-Rite flow meter will be an excellent modification for providing pleasurable boating. 😀

BTW... I love chatting with my English speaking (and English born) Gastroenterologist and the way she pronounces "poop" without any trace of a smile. :lol:

 

[baz]

KISS principle is often best! [emoji106]

Simplicity is sometimes overstated IMO. Many of the newer technologies do simplify life.

 

[baz]

Tomorrow I'm down to the Kent factory to install the Fill-Rite flow meter for measuring and recording the number of raw water gallons the head/toilet pulls in. Unfortunately I will not be able to assess how well this will work until we get the boat on the water. Once on the water and after a few head flushes to review this I will post a separate thread on how it works out. 🙂

 

[baz]

I visited the factory today....

I took my Fill-Rite Flow Meter with me to understand how best to install it. Andrew and I chatted about this and the simplest thing to do is to install it in the raw water inlet line forward of the T joint used to direct sea water to the pump for the cockpit's Washdown system, raw water w/hose. This line runs just under the deck floor and is in clear view on starboard side of the cockpit's center locker.This then will allow the flow meter to ONLY register/record the gallons of sea water being drawn in by the Toilet's pump. More on this in another posting. This install will be easy-peaseee and given the easy line of sight access to the flow meter the display will be clearly seen and its batteries will be easy to replace when needed. Note - the flow meter will retain its data when the 2x AA batteries are replaced.

 

[502mad]

Why doesn't the factory install tank level indicators?

 

[baz]

Why doesn't the factory install tank level indicators?

They do for fuel and fresh water. However, they obviously know trying to do same for the holding tank is simply asking for trouble. Many of the RT models the holding tank is visible and its level can be seen clearly so long as the tank's material hasn't clouded up making that level check impossible.

I've talked with RT about this and was told they see no good way for installing a robust level sensor in the holding tank that would stand up to years of good service.

 

[502mad]

Do you know if the black water tank is visible in the R23?

 

[baz]

Do you know if the black water tank is visible in the R23?

It is hidden by a double wall bulkhead between cabin and the V-Berth step. Just like for the new 2018 R-27.

I suspect my flow meter solution will work as well for the R-23 as it will for the new R-27.

 

[Rwnorton]

Baz, did you find a solution to the question of “how full is my holding tank”? Did you find any appropriate water flow meters?
I have an inboard R27 but the tank is opiquate so I have the same issue.

 

[baz]

Baz, did you find a solution to the question of “how full is my holding tank”? Did you find any appropriate water flow meters?
I have an inboard R27 but the tank is opiquate so I have the same issue.

Rwnorton: As I posted above I had the Flow-Rite flow meter installed and it is a good solution for the R-23 and R-27 outboard models IMO.

For your R-27 inboard diesel model you will need to find the line feeding raw water to your toilet and install the flow meter in it and in a place where it can be accessed easily for reading its display and for changing its batteries periodically. The flow meter display will inform you how many gallons have been drawn into the toilet bowl. So if your holding tank is say 30 gallons, then when the flow meter displays 25 gallons you should assume your holding tank is close to being full.

The flow meter I used was obtained at Amazon. The price for this device fluctuates a great deal so keep an eye on the price and click BUY when it's at a low point. 😱

At this time it's priced at $158.61 and I actually paid close to $220 at the time I made my purchase. The $158.61 is a low price at this time.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B06WGTYSZC/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[Red Raven]

Baz, did you find a solution to the question of “how full is my holding tank”? Did you find any appropriate water flow meters?
I have an inboard R27 but the tank is opiquate so I have the same issue.

As an alternative in case you missed it, we use the SCAD Solo in our R27 and it works well. It uses foil strips applied to the outside of the tank. No need to put anything in the tank and the display can be mounted anywhere in the boat that is convenient to be checked at any time. It doesn’t matter if the tank is opaque as long as it is plastic. I believe the system uses electrical impedance to determine the level.

http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1|51|2234305|2234306&id=1249539

The only thing I would caution regarding the flow meter is it only measures the amount of flush water drawn in. The volume of human waste and urine is not measured nor is any water that is entered from the head faucet directly to the bowl. We often use the head faucet to “help” it flush or just give it a fresh water rinse. That would not be measured. Over time you will learn the correlation between the flow and the actual level in the tank and adjust accordingly.