Sharrow Props

[Submariner]

Martin, thank you for this second 'user perspective' video, the partner to your first 'data intesive' video. This second one helped me get a good sense for what living with one of these modified 4 or 5 blade props is like vs. my 250's 3-blade 'factory prop'. One observation you made in video #1 was the difficulty you had in getting accurate fuel burn (mpg) numbers off the Yamaha engine display. That's sure true for my 250. 1.2, 1.4 and 1.6 are the only numbers I've ever seen when at planing speeds; nothing in-between them. For those of us with the basic electronics package, do you have any suggestions for getting better real time fuel burn data? Thanks again for the time you have put into this project.

Thanks for watching! I'm glad you found the second video helpful. Plus, I think it's great when LaZina gets in front of the camera.

The Garmin Chartplotter USED to show mpg. In April 2021, a software release "broke" it. I dunno why or what. I've spoken with Garmin about this, as it worked for the first year we owned the boat. mph / gph = mpg, those numbers are available on the chartplotter. Today, you can get mpg on the chartplotter only if you do NOT have the Yamaha to N2k gateway installed. All the new boats (2023 and newer) come with a J1939 cable for the chartplotter and no longer come with a Yamaha N2k gateway. The J1939 cable plugs engine data directly from the J1939 network into the chartplotter and mpg can easily be shown on the chartplotter. For those of us running the Lenco Autglide (auto-pilot for the trim tabs), it requires engine data to operate (engine RPM, specifically), it requires that data via Nema2k, which is only possible with a Yamaha to N2k gateway installed. If you ran a J1939 cable and a Yamaha N2k gateway to get both to work, the Chartplotter would see two engines.

My setup is Yamaha N2k gateway, which means I get MPH ad GPH on the chartplotter, but no mpg. Which leaves the Yamaha display for their 1.2, 1.4, or 1.6... I've also seen .9 (bad bad number... Lol).

This has been somewhat frustrating for me, but something I've just learned to live with. That's why I illustrated that in the video. I look for 30mph / 20gph which I know is 1.5mpg. If the numbers are too far apart, I'll just do the math on my phone. MPH / GPH and get my mpg number while driving.

 

[jack_patricia]

Of course, quite a simple workaround I can now see. Thank you, Martin.

 

[Submariner]

Do you have a 250 or 300 Yamaha? What size PowerTech did you put on?
I have a 2023 C248 w/ 250 and I need a new prop.

Call PowerTech and talk with them directly. They've got a lot of great data from me that should help them tune other boats built by Fluid Motion.

The F250 and F300 are the same 4.2l v6 from Yamaha. It's the same Yamaha service manual. The tune is different such that the F250 was designed for 87 octane gas and the F300 was designed for 89. However, in Puget Sound, most fuel docks only offer 87 octane. There's a company called NizPro that can flash the ECU on a F250 and get it over 300hp. However, once flashed, it'll require 89 octane fuel. That's why I haven't sent my ECU off my F300 to them. They claim to get about 330HP out of an F300. NizPro claimed they could get me the Prince Rupert to Shearwater numbers (MPG) I needed without changing the prop. But since I can't reliably get 89 octane, I focused on prop sizing instead.

That exhaust tube extension modification PowerTech has really makes a big difference in the midrange when compared to a conventional prop.

 

[Turbo]

RT25 stock prop info. the weakness if found was mid range compared to the other props. for me getting over 2 mpg was a goal. slow and fast was no problem. I have found a sweet spot at 15 mph with trim tabs all down getting 2 mpg. enjoying a trip to st Augustine fl with another rt 25. these boats are a plenty!

 

[Submariner]

I received my exhaust extension tube for my Prototype SCE5 prop on my R27-OB today. I'll get it installed this weekend, and will do a short video on how to put it together, what loctite to use, etc... They're anodized black and look sharp! Pictures can be found on the website below.

I've also updated our website with all the information and links to the videos about the prop testing and such.

Propeller | LetsGoChannelSurfing

www.letsgochannelsurfing.com

 

[Edmund]

So Sharrow now teaming up with Ford to bring down machine costs. Hmmm

Sharrow's madly torqued propellers make production quantum leap

Sharrow knew it had a market disruptor on its hands the instant it transformed propeller blades into more efficient twisted loops. The hold-up of that disruption, however, has been in getting those props out of the factory and onto the actual market. Now it receives a big helping hand from a rather…

newatlas.com

 

[Edmund]

So Sharrow now teaming up with Ford to bring down machine costs. Hmmm

Sharrow's madly torqued propellers make production quantum leap

Sharrow knew it had a market disruptor on its hands the instant it transformed propeller blades into more efficient twisted loops. The hold-up of that disruption, however, has been in getting those props out of the factory and onto the actual market. Now it receives a big helping hand from a rather…

newatlas.com

 

[Rocky Lou]

Not surprising since every time they post on Facebook, which is daily, they get ripped for being vastly overpriced...maybe a light in Greg's head after all.

 

[Edmund]

Not surprising since every time they post on Facebook, which is daily, they get ripped for being vastly overpriced...maybe a light in Greg's head after all.

Well I think it's kind of harsh to assume the developer of a new technology is not aware that he/she is going to have to scale it up to make it affordable for the masses. That said, please name any leap forward in technology and design that was NOT much more expensive at the beginning? Remember when a flat screen cost 7 thousand? When a super computer required an entire building to house it?

My hunch is that these props will be industry disrupters. Thats just semi educated guess. Most disrupters are expensive and the launch is a series of stops and starts.

 

[Rocky Lou]

Linux (RHEL), my company made a fortune selling 'free software' and we helped put my prior company, Sun, out of business along with much lower cost, non-proprietary processors. IBM bought us for $32B, we were born cheap but sold expensive.

You need to offer enough value to justify the price and if many of your potential customers are not believing it, and have been publicly disparaging the products, then it's not doing Sharrow any good to keep going down that path.

Sharrow has been going at it for years now...I know some key execs. who bailed.

 

[Submariner]

I've managed to exceed Sharrow prop performance numbers on the R27 for 40% of what a Sharrow costs.
($1230 for the PowerTech prop, $870 for the NizPro Eco tune vs $5k for a Sharrow).

The PowerTech SCE5 Channel Surfing edition prop and the NizPro eco tune and I've hit 2.1mpg at 31mph.

The Sharrow is a decent prop for what it does, but $5k per prop is steep.

 

[Edmund]

I've managed to exceed Sharrow prop performance numbers on the R27 for 40% of what a Sharrow costs.
($1230 for the PowerTech prop, $870 for the NizPro Eco tune vs $5k for a Sharrow).

The PowerTech SCE5 Channel Surfing edition prop and the NizPro eco tune and I've hit 2.1mpg at 31mph.

The Sharrow is a decent prop for what it does, but $5k per prop is steep.

what is the combined cost for the flashing by Niz Pro plus the 5 blade PowerTech prop?

 

[Submariner]

what is the combined cost for the flashing by Niz Pro plus the 5 blade PowerTech prop?

$1,230 for the PowerTech prop, $870 for the NizPro Eco tune = $2,100 total.

If you have twins, double it, and it's still less expensive than a single Sharrow.

 

[Edmund]

$1,230 for the PowerTech prop, $870 for the NizPro Eco tune = $2,100 total.

If you have twins, double it, and it's still less expensive than a single Sharrow.

thanks...I would have thought the tune would have been more, very interesting. What did the tune do to your effective HP?

 

[Submariner]

thanks...I would have thought the tune would have been more, very interesting. What did the tune do to your effective HP?

NizPro says the Eco tune boosts my F300 to 315HP. I won't notice 15HP. My WOT speed of 39mph used to be at 27.2gph. After the NizPro Eco tune, my WOT is still 39mph, but my GPH maxes out at 24.2. I'm now getting 1.6mpg at WOT, at 39mph with those numbers. The Eco tune only requires 87 octane, which is why I chose it over the Performance tune which would have given me 335 HP but would require 89 octane.

 

[venajeff]

In my past I spent many hours calculating speeds to miles per gallon and power outputs, now Martin just does everything for me.
What I am supposed to do to keep busy now?

 

[Edmund]

NizPro says the Eco tune boosts my F300 to 315HP. I won't notice 15HP. My WOT speed of 39mph used to be at 27.2gph. After the NizPro Eco tune, my WOT is still 39mph, but my GPH maxes out at 24.2. I'm now getting 1.6mpg at WOT, at 39mph with those numbers. The Eco tune only requires 87 octane, which is why I chose it over the Performance tune which would have given me 335 HP but would require 89 octane.

Great info thanks....did not know there was an Eco Tune and a Performance tune......but I had heard the tune would take a 250 to 335 - same block as the F 300 of course....so the same 335 as max HP. I suppose the Performance Tune is more expensive than the Eco Tune - but that's a guess.

Let me ask you this about a Niz Pro tune....would the 4.2L block tuned from 250 to 335 (or 315) improve hole shot or just at the mid ranges and upper end, which is where I've always heard that horse power kicks in.......and always heard "no replacement for displacement" regarding hole shot.

 

[Submariner]

Great info thanks....did not know there was an Eco Tune and a Performance tune......but I had heard the tune would take a 250 to 335 - same block as the F 300 of course....so the same 335 as max HP. I suppose the Performance Tune is more expensive than the Eco Tune - but that's a guess.

Let me ask you this about a Niz Pro tune....would the 4.2L block tuned from 250 to 335 (or 315) improve hole shot or just at the mid ranges and upper end, which is where I've always heard that horse power kicks in.......and always heard "no replacement for displacement" regarding hole shot.

The cost of the tune, Eco or Performance, is the same. The deciding factor is what gas is available to you. In Puget Sound and the San Juan Islands, most marinas only sell 87 octane fuel. Up and down the east coast, 89 octane is available, as well as in Canada and SE Alaska.

The deciding factor about the the prop vs the NizPro tune... A better tune will not give you mid-range cruising or improved reverse thrust. Hole shot would be increased somewhat with the performance tune, but wouldn't be near what the 5 blade prop would provide. NizPro can flash a F250 with the performance tune and get 335HP out of it (requires 89 octane fuel). The driver would notice this. The Eco tune will make the F250 a 315HP engine.

I advocate for both, actually, as they solve different issues. The prop solves mid range, reverse and hole shot, while providing a mild increase in fuel efficiency. The NizPro tune is a pure economics add-on, to improve fuel efficiency primarily at cruising speed (on plane) all the way to WOT. I'm seeing about a 10-12% fuel efficiency increase from the NizPro tune, on top of what I got with the 5 blade prop.

 

[Submariner]

In my past I spent many hours calculating speeds to miles per gallon and power outputs, now Martin just does everything for me.
What I am supposed to do to keep busy now?

Upgrade your boat to a new one with twins and I'll work with you on getting the performance data. 😀