Converting a stock RT or Cutwater to a long duration cruiser

scross

scross

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 30, 2015
Messages
2,059
Fluid Motion Model
C-28
Hull Identification Number
FMLC2831A717
Vessel Name
R-25 Classic - Sold
MMSI Number
367719470
I was asked on the Cutwater Facebook about converting our stock Cutwater 28 Northwest Edition to a longer duration cruiser. I wanted to start this thread with the modifications we made and, hopefully, getting input from others on the modifications they have made to their boats for longer duration cruising in the PNW.
Must have modifications/upgrades:
1. RIB dinghy or Takacat with gas or electric engine
2. Upgraded anchoring system - either Rocna, Vulcan or Mantus with complete spare rode, chain and anchor
3. Solar system with MPPT controller and a 300-500 watt solar panel plus a SmartShunt and battery voltage monitors
4. Upgraded engine and thruster batteries if stock was AGM or flooded.
5. Fully enclosed cockpit
6. Propane grill in cockpit
7. Backup navigation system - we use a iPad mini running Navionics but there are other options
8. PLB, EPIRB or Spot type device for emergency messaging
9. Spares and more spares! Belts, filters, hoses, bilge pumps, fluids, bulbs, blade fuses, thruster and windlass fuses, etc. ( a fully stocked spares kit would probably run several thousand dollars)
10. Extensive tool kit that includes everything you can think of using on the water - both electrical and mechanical
11. Portable freezer in cockpit
12. Extensive first aid kit and redundant safety gear
13. Handheld VHF radio
14. Fully equipped galley able to cook and serve a wide variety of meals
15. Length of boat mooring line with optional snubber
16. Cruising guides, Current Atlas and Ports and Passes reference guides

Nice to have upgrades:
1. Cargo box on sports rack
2. Kayak or paddle board
3. Cockpit cooler
4. Upgraded trim tab system
5. Upgraded sound system
6. Custom bedding
7. Quarters in USA and Loonies in Canada for showers
8. Laundry supplies
9. A well stocked pantry with a weeks or more worth of diversified meals

Ok guys, that’s my list. What am I missing?
 
Al, I'm trying to think of our forefathers that transit the oceans to reach our shores, or those that transit the great migration west in covered wagones. I personally think we as a whole are getting soft and find it funny that we can't live with out these luxuries. You already have a long term cruiser it just depends on which luxuries your willing to give up for the extra time on board. I have spent three weeks in the back country with what I could carry in my saddle bags, whisky is easier to carry than beer! Bob
 
Bob, I hear you on being cushy. I’m fast approaching 70 and my days of tent camping are long gone. Plus I really don’t want to be stranded out somewhere a long way from civilization.
Really cushy to me is marina-to-marina with shore power every night! Don’t do that anymore either….
 
Your list looks good. I basically have much of this on the boat all the time.

I’d actually remove the cockpit enclosure requirement
I also don’t see the need for upgrading the batteries if you have 400w of solar.

The 28 is weight sensitive. I’d try and keep as much weight off the boat.

Ultimately the cut 28 is not a remote exploration vessel as it has limited diesel and water capacity.
 
Gavin, good points!
With 40 gallons of fresh water in our tank and 10 gallons in collapsible containers we can go 5 days between fresh water refills. And 10 days between black water pump-outs if necessary. We can carry protein for 4+ weeks and fresh produce for a week.
We do our cruising from May to October and have found that having a dry cockpit, even in inevitable all day long downpours, to be important.
We think we are set up for up to 3-4 weeks cruising at a time. Given the limitation of fresh water every 5 days that is.
 
I tried it in my C26 Cutwater. The C26 and C28 have same living quarters. You can look at the list of upgrades I did on my Cutwater.The photo album shows most of them but not all. Bottom line it was a good 3 month boat after we did all the upgrades. The one item I did not do was the solar. There just was not enough room and the Radar dome obstructed the full capabilities of solar. I now have 600 watts using lead acid batteries (different boat with a lot more room for panels) That is just enough with lead acid. If I had lithium it would be enough. The other component that limits long term cruising is the water capacity. 30 gallons?? The advertised water capacity is 40 gallons of water. Fluid motion lied a little bit there!!! The tank is 30 gallons. The additional water capacity advertised is the 5 gallons in the hot water tank that is not usable after the 30 gallons of water is used up. I never could figure that math, 30 gallon water tank + 5 gallons in the hot water tank = 40 gallon capacity. The math that I came up with is 30 gallons usable!!! We carried( 2 ), 6 gallon grey water cans on board when we were doing more than 4 days of cruising without water fill up. When we did the trip down the river system Tenn-Tom to Mobile Bay 250 mile run we were out of water, out of fuel and had a waste tank completely full. Our last night on the hook we took dry soap shower and had enough water to rinse off saving enough water for coffee in the morning. That is just not enough water. Our friends installed 50 gallons in there C28 that helped but still needed more they then purchased a portable water maker. They then could shower daily and have enough water to live and cruise longer. I am beyond camping. We needed more beam and length to stay on board for long duration. The Cutwater as I had it equipped with custom bedding, shower curtain,extra battery capacity, Rockna anchor with wash down, full screened in enclosure for the cockpit, 2000 watt inverter that powered the completed 120V panel, custom shelving in the galley, larger TV, Wifi, 12Volt fans, 12 volt freezer, Extra fuel capacity, trim tab modifications, prop modifications, Dingy with motor davit...... the investment was tall but the bottom line 3 months max for two people to live on board and 3 days max on the hook. We like comfort and with the upgrades we were comfortable until we ran out of water and could not shower, ran out of battery and could not use the amenities and destroyed the expensive AGM batteries. Most of all we got tired of not having a place to lounge around. Sit up straight at the dinette, sit up straight at the helm of co pilots seat, lay in the V-berth, sit in a uncomfortable built in seat in the cockpit. All of which are comfortable for weekend cruising or a week of cruising but try to do that for months at a time! I loved my Cutwater for cruising and the ability to trailer. Stay on it for long durations as we planned did not work out no matter what I did. Buy a bigger boat for long term duration cruising. Sorry this is my opinion from my experience. I wish I had a better answer for you. The Cutwaters are awesome boats. I liked the C26 and C28. If you put to much on board they turn to slow over weight non performing boats. At least mine did. It went from a 20.5 kt boat to 16.5 kt boat when loaded for long term cruising. Your C28 with the larger D4 will not be as bad but you will notice performance loss. The larger boats with more beam and length and heavier displacement and more power don't seem to get effected by the additional weight.

My opinion! Good luck with your Long Duration Cruising. I wish I could have made it work. Loved my Cutwater!! My Mainship 34 Pilot has worked well and my wife loves it. As much as I don't want to admit I do too! We spent the last 9 months on board with a two week break at Christmas. We are on break number two now, after 9 months because we had to fly to Oregon for a few weeks to help my daughter. I can't wait to get back onboard to finish the last 1000 miles of our trip.

Bob, I AGREE on the beer. I need to have a storage capacity of 3 cases of beer and a couple handles of Volka to be comfortable. I can carry both with no need of saddle bags!!!
 
Brian,
You are right that the C-28 is not the right boat for trips 3-4 months at a time. Your new boat is a much better fit for that mission. I was talking about going from a stock C-28 that could go 3-4 days between full service marinas to one that could go up to 3-4 weeks at a time.
We use much less energy and fresh water cruising than I’m gathering you did in your C-26. No fresh water showers on the boat. We never ever use the inverter. We use about 1/2 of the energy you mentioned consuming per day on your C-26. Even with those lower consumption numbers we are quite comfortably on our cruises.
If we ever had a cruise planned that required more than five day between fresh water sources we could always get a Rainman portable fresh water maker and figure out how to deal with the extra 30 amp/hours per day that unit would require. That said, I’m not sure there are too many cruising destinations in the PNW other than the Broughtons where you can’t get fresh water every five days or so.

PS: One of the ways we stretch our fresh water is to wash dirty dishes and cooking pans in salt or lake water then give them a clean fresh water rinse. This saves us 1-2 gallons a day over washing solely with fresh water.
 
Have done some trips with my C-28, including a weeklong trip to Fire Island last year. Water was always the issue for me. I have a generator so power was not a problem, but water sure was. Always wondered why it gave out so quick so I appreciate Brian's assessment.

On a side note, I keep the boat in Mantoloking, NJ. The marina here has a transient dock and I noticed a Ranger Tug tied up. Might have been a 25 footer. I believe it was called Beyond, from North Tonawanda NY. The marina manager told me they had done the loop and the couple had been on the boat for a year! They weren't married and the guy reportedly said of the lady "She's a keeper!".

I guess you can get used to small places.

-martin610
 
There are many that do the Loop in Rangers and Cutwaters. 2022 AGLCA stats showed 13 Rangers completed the Loop. We met several this year from 25 to 31 and a few 28 Cutwaters are out there right now. It is all up to what is your comfort level? For us we felt the limitations caused us to stay in marinas more then we wanted too. We still stay at marinas at night more then we do on the anchor. Mostly because we want to see the history of the areas and visit the towns and cities. We have stayed on the hook 60 nights during the last 9 months. Roughly 2 months of 9 months anchored. Not in consecutive days. When we were cruising the Tennessee river we anchored 7 consecutive days without going to a facility for water, pump out or fuel and we stayed at one anchorage on Kentucky lake for 6 days relaxing and saving fuel!!! Based on our use we would not have been able to do this in the C26. Again its all up to an individuals comfort level. Cudo's to all that can enjoy roughing it and maintain being comfortable. I envy you!!
 
Martin,
Those brave and prepared enough to do Alaska have my deepest respect and admiration. I truly have no idea how that would be done with dogs onboard too!
We leave tomorrow for a relatively tame 19 day cruise from Bellingham to Desolation Sound and the Discovery Islands.
PS: I should have added a stern tie line reel and 300 ft (min) of 1/4” floating line to my original list of “must haves”.
Also in response to an earlier point about fuel capacity being a limiting factor - If I go 7 knots burning 2.0 GPH I figure I have a range of well over 300 statute miles. That’s plenty for me!
 
A few things on my list but not on yours:

-cell phone plus a cell signal strength booster system installed

-a Garmin Striker depth sounder installed as a backup to the factory installed sounder. While cruising I have one operating on the portside dash beside an iPad. The iPad displays Navionics mapping. My wife keeps watch on these devices as a backup to my navigating. She likes to keep an eye on where we are and what we are doing. The transducer is transom mounted.

-A lithium portable jump start battery. I use a Noco Boost GB 150 (3000A)

-all user manuals and cruise guides loaded onto an iPad

- Rechargeable flashlight(s). I have both handheld and the head strap on type for hands free operations.

-a small portable emergency toilet plus liner bags. I keep one in a locker under the V-berth. Barrel shape is easier to store in the V-berth locker of my R27.
 
scross":o55ov8x2 said:
Martin,
Those brave and prepared enough to do Alaska have my deepest respect and admiration. I truly have no idea how that would be done with dogs onboard too!
We leave tomorrow for a relatively tame 19 day cruise from Bellingham to Desolation Sound and the Discovery Islands.
PS: I should have added a stern tie line reel and 300 ft (min) of 1/4” floating line to my original list of “must haves”.
Also in response to an earlier point about fuel capacity being a limiting factor - If I go 7 knots burning 2.0 GPH I figure I have a range of well over 300 statute miles. That’s plenty for me!
Click to expand...

We are doing a lot of slow boating this week to extend range. 110 gallons usable (147 gallon tank) at 2.0 mpg doing 7-8 knots. That’s how we got into Tracy Arm and saw Sawyer Glacier.

On our way to Petersburg today from Tracy Arm. 80 gallons left, 55nm to go. 8 more hours at 3.9hph.
Once I know I won’t need my 50 gal reserve, I’ll pop up on plane the last 20 or so miles to Petersburg.

I’m also timing our arrival for near slack current into Petersburg. Peaks at 2.5knots today. Would rather dock in close to 0 knots of current.
 
scross":pwte2wos said:
Martin,
Those brave and prepared enough to do Alaska have my deepest respect and admiration. I truly have no idea how that would be done with dogs onboard too!
We leave tomorrow for a relatively tame 19 day cruise from Bellingham to Desolation Sound and the Discovery Islands.
PS: I should have added a stern tie line reel and 300 ft (min) of 1/4” floating line to my original list of “must haves”.
Also in response to an earlier point about fuel capacity being a limiting factor - If I go 7 knots burning 2.0 GPH I figure I have a range of well over 300 statute miles. That’s plenty for me!
Click to expand...

We are doing a lot of slow boating this week to extend range. 110 gallons usable (147 gallon tank) at 2.0 mpg doing 7-8 knots. That’s how we got into Tracy Arm and saw Sawyer Glacier.

On our way to Petersburg today from Tracy Arm. 80 gallons left, 55nm to go. 8 more hours at 3.9gph.
Once I know I won’t need my 50 gal reserve, I’ll pop up on plane the last 20 or so miles to Petersburg.

I’m also timing our arrival for near slack current into Petersburg. Peaks at 2.5knots today. Would rather dock in close to 0 knots of current.
 
Al,

Your list pretty much matches our set up on our R27 Classic. We did 70 days for our SE Alaska trip in 2019. It can be done! One exception, we do not have a full cockpit enclosure but have a modified Bimini to get better rain protection (we did, however, have exceptionally good weather!) Our longest leg without any new supplies, fuel, or water was 6 days from Juneau to Tracy Arm (including up and back to Sawyer Glacier), Ford’s Terror (up and back to North anchorage), and then to Petersburg (Total 225 nm). We did essentially all our SE AK travel at or below 7.5 knots averaging over 3nm/gal timing our travel using the currents to help.

One item that has not been mentioned is how to keep milk fresh while minimizing refrigerator space. Some freeze it in the extra cockpit freezer, some use powdered milk, we buy packs of UHT (Ultra High Temperature Pasteurization) milk in pint (kids size) cartons. These are real 100% milk with no difference in taste but do not need refrigeration until opened. They can be found in most grocery store chains (stock up before you leave and again in Juneau) on the shelf next to the milk substitutes (Soy Milk etc.). We still buy regular fresh milk when available to reserve the UHT milk for back up. Not really a boat feature but useful for long term cruising.

Curt
 
You might want to look at (Alaska in a 21 foot mini trawler) it's a story about Rick Huizi, Nate Steitmatter, and George Unterseher spending two months and there traveles up the inland passage to Alaska in 2003. This was accomplished on the Kentucky Colonel, Wren and Molly B, all of them classic R-21's. I will admit all three had no female supervision! Bob
 
Curt,
Good tip on the milk. Vicki said she saw a lot of UHT milk during her 6+ years in Alaska. Especially when she lived on the North Slope. It was new to me. Will give it a try.
 
Al,

We just returned from a 4 week cruise of south Florida ( on the Gulf side ) in our 25 SC. We have yet to customize the head to a composting one but plan on doing that. In the process adding another 30 gallon tank but using it for either water or fuel, not sure which yet. I tied 21 gallons of water (3 jugs) on the bow. We have installed a separate shower to use on the swim step. This is a huge improvement over the bathroom shower in our opinion. We have also switched to a 25 pound Mantus anchor ( works incredible even in sea grass or mud, or small gravel ).

We boat in very hot and humid weather so we have ac and a next gen generator 3.5 kw.

We also have a hand held radio as back up and we use it with the dingy to communicate with the boat when taking to dog to and from the sand.

If kept to 6, 6.5 knots we have a very respectable range. If traveling at 7 to 7.5 knots we still have nearly 300 mile range.

We traveled from Marco Island to Key West in a straight shot, so other than waiting for a weather window we do also have an EPIRB. we plan to boat from Biscayne Bay to Bimini and eventually to Other out islands so the EPIRB seems like a good idea. We also anchored for a night in the Marquesas. Updating the anchor helps me sleep better when far away in remote areas.

I have reusable ice cubes. When using these, I rarely open the cooler unless to get some food and the ice lasts so much longer.

Our biggest limiting factor is a tie with fresh produce and fresh water. If not taking showers, water lasts longer, but the produce needs resupply about once a week.

We learned we need to have a good supply of quarters on board to utilize washing machines and dryers.

Although we are ALWAYS the smallest boat in any marina, the little 25 SC makes a pretty fair accounting of itself. I am 6’2” and my wife is 6’. Our dog is 67 pounds. We lived for a solid 4 weeks on board, traveling at times 12 hours a day. We endured very hot-humid temps, many storms, some at anchor, strong currents, confused seas … we felt comfortable and safe. We are enjoying the planning of our next trip.
 
I have a C28 and have been on the Great Loop for the past month with my wife and our Golden Doodle. Interestingly enough, I was just docked next to Brian's Port A Gee for two days this past week. And, seeing his boat, I would agree that it is a very good Looper boat. However, don't underestimate the C28. It is very capable of extended travel. We started our Loop from Williamsburg, VA, and plan to go up the Rideau to Ottawa, Canada. Then, trailer the boat home and continue on next year. However, we are enjoying our trip so much that we now plan to continue across Canada on the Trent Severn, into the Georgian Bay, up the North Channel, and eventually, down Lake Michigan.

To make the boat more practical for extended trips, I have made several modifications. I have the LE model, and in the forward berth I removed the bench seat and installed custom dresser draws. I also installed two slide out draws under the bed. I took out the wine cooler, made the hole larger, and installed slide out pantry draws. In the cockpit area, I reconfigured the cabinet that housed the cooler. It now contains a large Yeti type cooler that slides out for easy access.

I also have improved the electronics. I upgraded the Garmin program to include Auto Guidance. I installed a night vision camera, and a rear vision camera. I installed a permanent satellite internet system. I added the Vesper Cortex AIS. I added and additional transducer that provides clear view and side view, as well as water temperature. And, I installed Nebo Link.

As for the economy of the C28, it is hard to beat. Under normal conditions, on plane, I can usually run 22 mph using 10 gph, which equates to 2.2 miles per gallon. On this trip, fully loaded, including the kitchen sink, I am running just under 2 mpg. Oh, let's not forget that I also carry an inflatable that sits vertically across the transom, catching the wind. Of course, at very low speed, which much of the Loop requires, the mpg goes way up. I have talked to several Ranger Tug and Cutwater outboard owners that claim the best they get is about 1.6 mpg. The price of fuel varies a lot. Yesterday, I got diesel for $3.59 a gallon. Today, 30 miles away, the price was $5.19. As for the price of gas, it is always significantly higher than diesel.
 
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